Stage2Omega -- is quickly becoming as big of a LIAR as OKIE and TONY!

Stage2Omega Direct Intel Tuesday AM Emailed to Recaps
10/01/2013

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Stage2Omega: DIRECT INTEL 7:50 AM EST

PER CONVERSATIONS WITH PEOPLE IN THE KNOW, LOOK TO EXCHANGE BETWEEN TODAY & OCTOBER 4TH.

THE GOVERNMENT SHUT DOWN IS ABOUT OBAMACARE & HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE RESET. UN RATES HAVE UPDATED WITH NO CHANGES.

GOVERNMENT OFFICIALS COMPLETED EXCHANGES LAST WEEK.

THE GREAT NEWS!!!!!! THE GOVERNMENT SHUT DOWN IS THE COVER TO HIDE THE GCR AND MILLIONS OF PEOPLE EXCHANGING AT BANKS.............
....

Stage2Omega -- is quickly becoming as big of a LIAR as OKIE and TONY!

Becoming?

WOW... one country in the entire world shut down the government... it has to be about the global reset.. it couldn't be about the fact that we have kindergarteners that run our country and they wont even look at each other, much less speak to each other..
No it has to be a cover up..
Oh and Dennis Rodman is my contact and he says Wells Fargo has the giant red button and they would press it but they are having trouble with the key to open the glass case protecting it... looks like another delay..

Compared to these clowns the government is a lily white teller of truth ...

WOW...now that's nasty!!
I am very happy to be signing up for Obamacare thank you.

:cheers:

dinarstar...Good to hear.  When medicare was first introduced the doubters cried the same tune and now look.  There will be some fine tuning along the way, but it will work.  What a terrible dilemma, all American citizens with healthcare.  Disgusting!!!         
 

There are however significant differences. The biggest being the medicare law was (over all) well written by folks who actually read and debated what they wrote because they were actually trying to help people not promote an agenda. It did not establish hundreds of thousands of pages of regulations that no one understands, nor did it establish a police force to enforce compliance.

Medicare works and works well because it was kept (mostly) simple, especially on the public end, and in fact has been simplified over time. Obama care did not, and truthfully needs an  overhaul, not a little tweaking. 

What a terrible dilemma, all American citizens with healthcare.  Disgusting!!!

In a way, yes. For many, the fact that this mandates healthcare for all whether they want it or not, is the most odious part of the bill. Many I talk to object, not to having healthcare, but to being told they must have it and what it will must consist of. That runs against the grain for those with even a slight libertarian bent.

you can not fine tune an item that is "non negotiable" just saying

dinarstar wrote:WOW...now that's nasty!!
I am very happy to be signing up for Obamacare thank you.

:cheers:

I bet you were not successful, 313 mil people in this country and the system was not designed to handle the 3 mil that checked it out yesterday... so much for supplying the WHOLE country healthcare.. they have had a whole year and cant even get the website right... I cant wait until they start having glitches while performing surgeries.

I, for one, do not want the IRS overseeing my healthcare.  The security questions were not even loaded in the state I'm in.  And it took 30 minutes to get to that part.  Yes, the system we have isn't perfect, but this is just a mess.

!5% of the country who otherwise would have been out of luck are elated as of October 1st.  The 85% of those that have or can afford their current plans do not have to do a damn thing if they choose.  I have lived where social health insurance programs upon introduction were opposed by the opposition govt.  When the opposition gained power, guess what happened?  Nothing!  Why?  The program works and to take it away at that point would have been political suicide.

I can't speak about the 15% ... well actually I can, in my job I have run into more than a few who do not want and can not afford to purchase the health insurance, so at least a portion of 15% are not so elated. As the the 85%, My wife and I have both seen our costs, both premiums and co-pays, go up by close to 25%. My daughter has seen her insurance premiums go up by about 15% while their annual deductible doubled to close to 4K. Market surveys indicate that the average family of 4 will see a close to $7000 annual increase in out of pocket costs.

As I indicated before, my main issues are the quality, or rather lack of quality of the legislation, the mandatory nature of the legislation and the use of agents to enforce it ... BIG problem there. The health care act should have never been passed the way it was, no one understood it, and few if any, fully understand it today. There is absolutely no reason for any bill to be as large and cumbersome as this monster. Couple that with hundreds of thousands of new regulations from dozens of agencies and we don't have a few tweaks needed, but a nightmare in the offing.

I have seen and heard enough about socialized medicine to make me nervous, but since I have not been able to verify to where I am comfortable with the factualness of it all, I will not share at this time, other than to say when I was in healthcare we saw an awful lot of Canadians coming to the US for tests/procedures that would have had to wait months for in Canada. This is not going to be pretty.

Kevind53 wrote:I can't speak about the 15% ... well actually I can, in my job I have run into more than a few who do not want and can not afford to purchase the health insurance, so at least a portion of 15% are not so elated. As the the 85%, My wife and I have both seen our costs, both premiums and co-pays, go up by close to 25%. My daughter has seen her insurance premiums go up by about 15% while their annual deductible doubled to close to 4K. Market surveys indicate that the average family of 4 will see a close to $7000 annual increase in out of pocket costs.

As I indicated before, my main issues are the quality, or rather lack of quality of the legislation, the mandatory nature of the legislation and the use of agents to enforce it ... BIG problem there. The health care act should have never been passed the way it was, no one understood it, and few if any, fully understand it today. There is absolutely no reason for any bill to be as large and cumbersome as this monster. Couple that with hundreds of thousands of new regulations from dozens of agencies and we don't have a few tweaks needed, but a nightmare in the offing.

I have seen and heard enough about socialized medicine to make me nervous, but since I have not been able to verify to where I am comfortable with the factualness of it all, I will not share at this time, other than to say when I was in healthcare we saw an awful lot of Canadians coming to the US for tests/procedures that would have had to wait months for in Canada. This is not going to be pretty.

Its obvious that the heath care system needed to be kicked in the rear to help EVERYONE out.. however as kevin has stated, my insurance has almost doubled in cost in the last 2 years and has tripled in the last 5 years.. some of it is due to the rise in health care, but most is because of what is happening in this country with the new reform.

I'm sorry but we are broke.. we just do not have the money to fund another program.. now yes in a perfect world many will open their pockets for the needy and they will all pitch in and everything will be ok.. but this is not a perfect world nor a perfect country and people will not do that...

Here is my thoughts.. health care costs needed to be dealt with.. such as gas prices... put a cap on em.. end of story
Make health care insurance companies except preexisting conditions.. and keep the companies competitive by given incentives to lower their rates..
This will not only IMPROVE our health care system, but it would cost a fraction of the price instead of a full on revamp..

highlander I understand where you are coming from and respect your input... But I will state that when most countries underwent a complete reform they were not on the verge of defaulting on their debts like we are... the last thing we need is another leech program... It could and probably will work, however we will suffer greatly for it.

Ok, Daox13, I am now nominating you for the next Presidential Elections... you can run Iraq and the US!

Several points I would like to make:  There have been many changes made that were not voted on in the original plan; such as the exemption for business owners and other special interest groups.  Where are the individuals who employers do not provide insurance go?  Into Obamacare.  I believe they want to limit people's choice as much as possible and grow another government program.

Many states have low income health insurance available with premiums based on income.  I assume Medicaid insures others with no income.  I understand how expensive it is for some treatments (cancer for one) and pre-existing conditions are a problem too.  These need to be addressed, but to do such a massive overhaul when our finances are in such bad shape doesn't make fiscal sense.  Already costs are way above what was forecast.  Out of all the insured, how many are there by their own choice?  I know some people that could afford insurance now, but have chosen to get that second truck, flat screen TV, etc.  They go to the ER, get treated and the responsible people w/insurance pay thru higher premiums.  That sense of entitlement has came back around and bit us in the butt.  Now it's going to be against the law not to have health insurance and the IRS is going to be in charge.  That's not a free country!

We are going to have a shortage of doctors.  There will be many taking an early retirement and students have opted for other careers when their first choice was medicine.  We are a compassionate country and we need to find a way that people don't fall through the cracks...but this way?  I'd rather not.

I talked to a friend yesterday who was told by her insurance company that she was going to have to go to ObamaCare. It means starting the entire process over and she's already reached her maximum payout for services for the year. She's pretty ticked!

I'd say anything the govt does winds up being expensive and extremely inefficient. DMV? IRS? Govt websites are the worst in the country.  

The reason health care is so expensive is due to the insurance and pharmaceutical industries jacking up prices and creating a cumbersome monopoly. No wonder many doctors are going private and offering concierge services.

You make it sound like thousands of Canucks are running to the US for treatment or they will die.  Not true.  The ones that do go for non threatening life procedures can afford to do so.  I have had family members with serious health concerns and they have never had to wait for excellent treatment.  Would it really matter what the state of the US economy is on whether you would accept a affordable healthcare program?  Leech program?  I do not believe it.  Good luck to all the doubters and congrats to the millions that will now benefit. 

P.S.  There are no death panels.   

No I never said thousands, although now that you mention it across the border states it probably is since we saw 3 or 4 at least for MRI's at the little rural hospitals I was working at. Yes, they were non life threatening, but still had some urgency. I know I would have been in trouble If I had needed to wait 4 to 6 months to get my knee scanned and another 4 or 5 for surgery to be scheduled, and those were the types of people we saw. Unfortunately, there ARE instances of people who have died because the only CT scan or other high tech device in town was not available for some reason.

What would it matter? I dunno, but in my state, the average rate increase for someone my age is 68% that matters a lot to me and is definitely having a negative impact on my economy. Yes, there are a lot of Americans uninsured, about 15% but this program is not the way to fix it, and ultimately we will end up worse off than we are now. It's just a matter of time. Until they deal with the issues driving up healthcare costs such as tort reform, anything they do will ultimately fail. Deal with that, and most of the rest of the issues will take care of themselves without a massive wasteful, ineffective legislative package filled with Easter eggs for the cronies and rotten eggs for the rest of us.

You have a choice.  Stick to your present option if it works for you.   I will not convince you and you will not convince me as to the benefit and numbers.  I have lived in both situations.  I personally would  be pissed to live in a country where health care for some is denied.  Fortunately that time has passed.

Highlander wrote:You have a choice.  Stick to your present option if it works for you.   I will not convince you and you will not convince me as to the benefit and numbers.  I have lived in both situations.  I personally would  be pissed to live in a country where health care for some is denied.  Fortunately that time has passed.

That's part of the problem, for many they don't have a choice. They have a good plan now that they can't keep despite the government's promises. Worse case, I am just a few years from Medicare. Hopefully, I'll be able to keep the coverage I have until then.

No choice?  Come on.  You will be fortunate to have medicare, that the right opposed when it was introduced.  This is why I am positive.

what do you mean becoming he has been there for a while

Highlander, I don't understand what you mean by being "denied" healthcare.  No was is denied.  Again, many states have low income health care available and medicaid for the poor.

sssmith...Are you living in a bubble?  This is just one article.

http://www.propublica.org/blog/item/insurers-denied-health-coverage-to-1-in-7-people-citing-pre-existing-condit

Highlander wrote:No choice?  Come on.  You will be fortunate to have medicare, that the right opposed when it was introduced.  This is why I am positive.

As I said before, medicare was a well written bill. It's total length is about 50 pages, while The Health Care Reform Act is 1990 pages long -- Yes that's right 1990 pages, I checked the official certified PDF copy from the Library of Congress to be sure. That's a Tom Clancy novel (RIP Tom), and then a bunch.

Actually the Republicans neither opposed or supported it, they were pretty evenly split down the middle in both the house and the Senate. There actually does not appear to have been any significant debate over the bill.

BTW the costs to the individual for Medicare has risen from the original $3.00/month for Part B to 104.90 for 2013. Part A costs have risen considerably as well, but are covered by payroll (FICA) taxes as long as you have worked 40 or more quarters.

I work with Medicare all the time, and spend much of my week giving advice to retirees 65 and over. The biggest issue in the offing is the increasing number of medical professionals who no longer accept Medicare payments due to low reimbursement rates. (I have seen claims were the allowed expense was 10-15% of the usual and customary fee.) It's not reached a critical mass yet, but it's coming. Medicaid is coming even faster.... and in some parts of the country has already become an issue.

Highlander wrote:sssmith...Are you living in a bubble?  This is just one article.

http://www.propublica.org/blog/item/insurers-denied-health-coverage-to-1-in-7-people-citing-pre-existing-condit

Working in the industry, I would say it is likely lower than that, at least here in Vermont. The fact is every state sets their own standards, and every state tells the insurance companies what they can and can't do, so from my viewpoint, if people were being denied coverage, the states shared much of the blame. They approved the plans before they were offered for sale. 

Speaking to Medicare, my area of expertise, anyone can get supplemental coverage, initially with no medical questions, although their choices may be limited later on except for special circumstances. All Medicare Advantage plans I have seen ask no medical questions and would be available to anyone.

ssmith wrote:Highlander, I don't understand what you mean by being "denied" healthcare.  No was is denied.  Again, many states have low income health care available and medicaid for the poor.

SSsmith is mostly correct. Every state has some sort of Medicaid program, and some sort of assistance for the chronically ill. Again, they set their own guidelines, and will continue to do that, even under the Healthcare Reform Act so your mileage will vary from state to state.

ssmith wrote:Highlander, I don't understand what you mean by being "denied" healthcare.  No was is denied.  Again, many states have low income health care available and medicaid for the poor.

It seems here that "health care" is being confused with "insurance".

Anyone can get health care by walking into an emergency room. Who's going to pay for it is another question.

onemore wrote:

ssmith wrote:Highlander, I don't understand what you mean by being "denied" healthcare.  No was is denied.  Again, many states have low income health care available and medicaid for the poor.

It seems here that "health care" is being confused with "insurance".

Anyone can get health care by walking into an emergency room. Who's going to pay for it is another question.

Good point. And the truth is anyone walking into an ER or urgent care center at a hospital will receive care. Maybe at taxpayer expense, but they'll get it.

...here is the thing,illegals walk in and out of ER every day,costing tax payers billions every year to the great angst of said taxpayers...so,as a taxpayer without healthcare I should lower myself to doing the same?
The two scenarios are very different.
I will pay for my Obamacare quite gladly thank you...as soon as the glitches are taken care of,which,according to the local channel today are almost cleared.

Obama care was supposed to cost 800 billion. The cost is now up to 1.4 Trillion.  And they know that is absolutely a LOW number. So it is going to be more.  Where do you think that money is coming from?  

They already take 45 % of my paycheck in taxes.  I don't want to pay for 1 more unworking person in the United States.

dinarstar wrote:...here is the thing,illegals walk in and out of ER every day,costing tax payers billions every year to the great angst of said taxpayers...so,as a taxpayer without healthcare I should lower myself to doing the same?
The two scenarios are very different.
I will pay for my Obamacare quite gladly thank you...as soon as the glitches are taken care of,which,according to the local channel today are almost cleared.

So when you say you are without healthcare, you mean you don't have a doctor? Or there isn't an urgent care facility or hospital where you live?

I apologize...HEALTH INSURANCE...but now I do yeaaaay!!

Kevin...you and others make it sound so easy for the uninsured.   In many case the care is below standard or inadequate.  There are countless stories of the uninsured being turned away from hospital emergency rooms because of their status.  Many do not survive being re-routed to a county hospital.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1495228/


Chicago’s Cook County is home to three major hospitals and sixteen public health clinics. At John H. Stroger Hospital, the county’s largest public hospital, approximately 10,000 people visit the emergency room each month. Understaffed and overused, emergency room waits at Stroger range anywhere from the typical 10 hours to over 30 hours.

Many emergency room patients have no health insurance, and have no other option than to use the hospital emergency services as their last or only resort. With double digit unemployment swelling the ranks of the uninsured, hospital staffs are being overwhelmed with patients, including many suffering from chronic or non-life-threatening conditions, who do not have a regular physician or the means to pay for care.

SINGLE PAYER

" First, healthcare must be recognized as a right, not a privilege. Every man, woman and child in our country should be able to access the healthcare they need regardless of their income. Second, we must create a national healthcare system that provides quality healthcare for all in the most cost-effective way possible.
Tragically, the United States is failing in both areas.
It is unconscionable that in one of the most advanced nations in the world, there are nearly 50 million people who lack health insurance and millions more who have burdensome co-payments and deductibles. In fact, some 45,000 Americans die each year because they do not get to a doctor when they should. In terms of life expectancy, infant mortality and other  health outcomes, the United States lags behind almost every other advanced country.
Despite this unimpressive record, the US spends almost twice as much per person on healthcare as any other nation. As a result of an incredibly wasteful, bureaucratic, profit-making and complicated system, the US spends 17% of its gross domestic product -- approximately $2.7tn annually -- on healthcare. While insurance companies, drug companies, private hospitals and medical equipment suppliers make huge profits, Americans spend more and get less for their healthcare dollars.
What should the US be doing to improve this abysmal situation?
President Obama's Affordable Care Act is a start. It prevents insurance companies from denying patients coverage for pre-existing conditions, allows people up to age 26 to stay on their parents' insurance, sets minimum standards for what insurance must cover and helps lower-income Americans afford health insurance. When the marketplace exchanges open for enrollment on Tuesday, many Americans will find the premiums will be lower than the ones they're paying now. Others will find the coverage is much more comprehensive than their current plans.

Most importantly, another 20 million Americans will receive health insurance. This is a modest step forward. But if we are serious about providing quality care for all, much more needs to be done.
The only long-term solution to America's healthcare crisis is a single-payer national healthcare program.
The good news is that, in fact, a large-scale single-payer system already exists in the United States and its enrollees love it. It is called Medicare. Open to all Americans over 65 years of age, the program has been a resounding success since its introduction 48 years ago. Medicare should be expanded to cover all Americans.
Such a single-payer system would address one of the major deficiencies in the current system: the huge amount of money wasted on billing and administration. Hospitals and independent medical practices routinely employ more billing specialists than doctors -- and that's not the end of it. Patients and their families spend an enormous amount of time and effort arguing with insurance companies and bill collectors over what is covered and what they owe. Drug companies and hospitals spend billions advertising their products and services.
Creating a simple system with one payer, covering all Americans, would result in an enormous reduction in administrative expenses. We would be spending our money on healthcare and disease prevention, not on paper-pushing and debt collection.
Further, a single-payer system will expand employment opportunities and lift a financial weight off of businesses encumbered by employee health expenses. Many Americans remain at their current jobs because of the decent health insurance provided by their employer. Without the worry of losing benefits, those Americans will be free to explore other, more productive opportunities as they desire. For business owners, lifting the burden of employee healthcare expenditures will free them to invest in growing their businesses.
Congressman Jim McDermott and I have introduced the American Health Security Act. Our bill will provide every American with healthcare coverage and services through a state-administered, single-payer program, including dental and mental health coverage and low-cost prescription drugs. It would require the government to develop national policies and guidelines, as well as minimum national criteria, while giving each state the flexibility to adapt the program as needed. It would also completely overhaul the health coverage system, creating a single federal payer of state-administered health plans.
The American people understand that our current healthcare system is not working. But the time is long overdue for them to understand that there is something fundamentally wrong when the US remains the only country in the industrialized world that does not guarantee healthcare to all its people.
Healthcare is a right and we must ensure provision of that right for Americans. A single-payer system will be good for the average American, good for businesses, good for workers and good for our overall economy."

- Bernie Sanders is the independent U.S. Senator from Vermont.

I have been there, done that, got the T-shirt. Our first was born with no health insurance, because we could not afford it. I have had surgery on my shoulder and knee without insurance. So I am aware of both sides of the spectrum.

Bernie is unfortunately my Senator. I and painfully aware of his stance of most issues, and have absolutely no use for him. The only reason he runs as an independent, is because if he ran as a communist people might not vote for him. He is totally big government, socialized everything, and has never been known to let a fact get in his way. Yea, I dislike him a lot. I will give him one thing though, if you write him you will always get an answer, even if it is, "TS I've already decided for you."

There's some interesting reading here:  https://www.facebook.com/Healthcare.gov

Troy Russell example...His insurance provider transitioned his current plan to an ACA plan?  Why didn't his private insurance just allow him to remain with their policy?  Does not add up?

Carolyn Borders: My husband and I are thirty years old. We have worked very hard and have had expensive, employer provided, insurance, that covered almost nothing. After both being laid off and only being able to find jobs with no insurance and much lower pay, we have been without health insurance. To compound, we don't qualify for family coverage under a personal insurance plan, because our daughter has special needs. Even if we did qualify we can't afford it. Our healthcare system doesn't work, period. I will embrace any attempt to repair it and endure the growing pains, to be able to afford healthcare for my family. I appreciate our government attempting SOMETHING to repair our healthcare system. I'm sure there will be changes made, in time. Sitting around talking about how broken the system is, was getting us nowhere. Action has to be taken and it finally is. Yes, the site is down. Its really to be expected with so much traffic. That just shows how many people and families are desperate for affordable, undeniable, healthcare.

156 · October 2 at 6:45am

Further on troy Russell's situation:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/09/30/%3Fp%3D63297/


Comments section:
tommy2012
10/2/2013 10:17 PM CST

Call them back!! I have dealt with them extensively on this. As usual, you have to fight with insurance companies. This is no different. They can't automatically enroll you for 2014. And you can cancel with any life changing event which includes going into Medicare. The problem here is that by NC not taking the subsidized Medicaid expansion, only a few Insurance companies want to participate in NC. Thank your state legislature. And check other non-ACA providers for coverage if you don't qualify for subsidies (which it appears from your quotes).

Well....I'll weigh in.  I'm a 58 yr old American living in Canada for the past 18 years.  I have lived with both the U.S. health care system and now the Canadian socialized health care system.  No one system is perfect....all have their respective glitches.  But I must say, being a cardiac patient, having had 3 heart ops, as well as living with a chronic care special needs child for 19 years (he passed away 2 years ago),  have experienced great care here.  Choice of any doctor...no wait times for critical care...extended hospital stays...and the physicians seem to be in it for the Hippocratic oath rather than the money.  I prefer this system.  I believe the care I get is the same in both countries. I admit...our taxes are high, but I do like the fact that I never have to be concerned about premiums, and for me...whenever I walk into an emerg. dept., I am treated with compassionate care.

Highlander wrote:Further on troy Russell's situation:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/09/30/%3Fp%3D63297/


Comments section:
tommy2012
10/2/2013 10:17 PM CST

Call them back!! I have dealt with them extensively on this. As usual, you have to fight with insurance companies. This is no different. They can't automatically enroll you for 2014. And you can cancel with any life changing event which includes going into Medicare. The problem here is that by NC not taking the subsidized Medicaid expansion, only a few Insurance companies want to participate in NC. Thank your state legislature. And check other non-ACA providers for coverage if you don't qualify for subsidies (which it appears from your quotes).

As I said earlier, it ultimately comes down to what the state agencies allow and disallow. They set the rules, the insurance companies play by their rules. Am I saying there are not some bad companies out there, hell no, there are some terrible ones, but if they are, it is because the states and federal regulators let them get away with it.

I can only speak to where I have experience, and here in Vermont, anyone who does not have insurance does so either because they are idiots or they just don't want it. There are just way to many programs offered. On the other hand, we are seeing folks who were receiving subsidies under the old system who are having to pay 2 or 3X as much now because of the changes. As an agent, I have seen a lot of angst and confusion, not a lot of improvement.

Producer1...An interesting perspective from one who has experienced first hand each system.

*More than 90 per cent of Canadian physicians are incorporated, which has some tax advantages, such as lower taxes, income splitting (paying a salary to a spouse, for example), and deferring tax payments by holding money in the corporation.  The salary of the average Canadian doctor has spiked to nearly 4 1/2 times that of the average worker or by about 30 per cent over the past decade.