Critical Analysis of IQD Information

by Alchemist Wed Dec 21, 2011 1:15 pm

moneyshow.com/trading/article/26/currency-22033/The-Scam-That-Wont-Die

CURRENCY CORNER
Why Won't the Iraqi Dinar Scam Die?

Starry-eyed investors take to the Web, but the
scammers have beaten them there—and neither
is eager to give up the dream of getting rich off
the Iraqi dinar.
John Jagerson is on a lonely quest to debunk the
Iraqi dinar scam, but it's not easy these days.
The investment analyst first posted
comprehensive stories on his site in 2009—
which have since replayed at MoneyShow.com
and elsewhere—that clearly explain why the
Iraqi currency is not likely to dramatically
increase in value once the country stabilizes.
In fact, he points out, recent history suggests
the dinar could lose value against the dollar.
Look at Venezuela, Turkey, and Mexico, whose
currencies weakened when the economy
strengthened, or the Kuwaiti dinar, which did
not strengthen in the early ‘90’s as sellers now
suggest, and later even plummeted.
Jagerson is a bona fide expert, and he’s done his
homework. His argument seems
incontrovertible, if only for the reason that any
opportunity that promises a high return at low
risk should be suspect anyway.
Which is why the reaction he gets from readers
is so mystifying. Even at savvy investing sites,
the tone of the feedback largely amounts to one
of indignation: Angry comments and flaming e-
mails from people who have already bought
dinars, or who have read enough on the
Internet to know that they want to.
“I still can’t explain why I get so many negative
e-mails from investors,” Jagerson says. “I think
it’s that people don’t like having their dream
challenged.”
Jagerson is hardly alone in his frustration.
Financial experts and consumer watchdogs say
the job of debunking financial myths has
become astoundingly difficult in the Web 2.0
era, where search is king, algorithm trumps fact,
and a vocal minority can tweet, blog, and
comment to millions from the Internet rooftop.
The result: By the time an investor finally does
stumble upon a credible source, his dreams
have had an awfully long time to marinate in a
bad idea.
“We’re having to disabuse them of these
notions,” says Richard Jaramillo, an examiner
with the Utah Division of Securities, who’s been
fighting the Iraqi dinar myth for years. “It’s
much tougher for them to understand the risks
if you can’t even get them to believe what
you’re saying.”
Good Info Is Hard to Find
Ryan Thorpe is not naive. The 26-year-old Iraqi
war veteran is studying to become a mechanical
engineer and works as a quality-control
specialist in the Houston oil industry. When a
fellow soldier gave him $300 in Iraqi dinar
several years ago, he remained skeptical.
He didn’t believe, as some of his colleagues did,
that his little stack of paper could suddenly be
worth tens or even hundreds of thousands of
dollars after some magic Iraqi currency
revaluation.
Back home and curious, he decided to do his
own “objective” research, and that’s when
things got confusing. Thorpe, like many people,
doesn’t have a personal financial advisor. But
he’s young, smart, and comfortable online.
Here’s what he found:
A simple search of “iraqi” and “dinar” returns
dozens of different “informational” sites on
buying and selling the dinar. However, three-
quarters of the top results—those on the first
four pages—are actually links to private
companies that sell the dinar.
The sites provide links to news stories that
back the prognosis: The Iraqi economy is
destined for growth. It’s “The sleeper
investment of the decade,” headlines
BetOnIraq.com, “because liberty breeds
prosperity.”
Self-described experts pass on “inside
information” speculating on when the dinar
will revalue. “They really stir up a buying
frenzy,” says Thorpe.
Sites seem to offer consumer protection—
with advice on how to avoid counterfeit bills,
and information on various investment
options. They point out that they are certified
with the US Treasury Department and are a
member of the Better Business Bureau.
The sites presume only high profits. One of
the high rankers, dinartrade.com, displays
payout options on an $833 investment today
of between $10,000 and $1 million. “Picture
Iraq as a company selling stock. Each dinar
you purchase represents a share in Iraq ’s
bright future,” the site reads. “Iraq 's economy
can only improve. The dinar will appreciate in
value as the oil-driven economy booms.”
Aside from a recent brief in USA Today and
Jagerson’s article, none of the first 40 page
links even raises the notion that the dinar
investment may rest on a flawed premise.
“I can’t see what’s not persuasive about it,”
says Thorpe, who decided to start searching for
dinar-investment stories within news sites
instead, but came up dry.
“Finding real news and credible sources is
almost impossible,” he says. “So first-time
investors go out there and they see all this and
think, ‘Well, of course it’s going to happen.’”

by sunstarhb Wed Dec 21, 2011 2:08 pm

Alchemist,

Do you agree?

by ruthie23 Wed Dec 21, 2011 2:24 pm

I agree that the get rich quick presentation of the majority of the sites for little outlay can be perceived as a scam, very easily.

I do not agree that Iraq can be compared to any other country. It is in a quite unique situation. Potentially one of the richest nations in the world, and not just with oil. Minerals, metals and agriculture all have massive potential.

They have had an artificial rate, anyone with an ounce of economic know how sees that, and Dr Shabibi has been categoric about revaluing the currency once the time is right.

So I just think Jagerson and the mechanic are both entitled to their opinion, I disagree but do not agree that the rate will be high. Always planned on 10 cents and would be thrilled with 86 cents.

Just my opinion.

by therealbutterfly Wed Dec 21, 2011 2:46 pm

Right there with ya Ruthie!!!!

by bwest Wed Dec 21, 2011 3:16 pm

All I can say is read your BIBLE. This is Biblical FOLKS.. Like I tell everyone.. I'm either going to look like a Genuis or a complete idiot. I'll take my chances..I'm a dinar holder, I've done my own research as well as several others I know and I believe this will happen. Yes there are a lot of scams out there but I do not think this is a scam. There are so many people out there that don't believe this can happen. Look at the news, where is this money coming from for EU and the US just passed a 1 trillion dollar spending budget.. if we are broke how does this happen?? Where is this money coming from people? Theres a lot of misdirection and just flat out BS news from this clowns article.. (not the guy who posted the article) and the media. This is going to happen.. You are blessed and highly favored. I don't know when.. I hope soon. Life is about TAKING RISKS.. whether its in a marriage, an investment..ect...every dinar holder has taken a risk.

I hope the rate is high but think it will be around 3.50... just guessing here like the rest of us. I do not believe .10 or even .86., nor do I believe 8-9 dollars.. it has to be at least 1 to 1. No I'm not a guru.. I have no contacts, just my own opinion and research.. I think the people figuring it low are just complete idiots... dropping the 3 zeros doesnt mean .86.. right now it shows. .00086..... they are talking about gettting rid of the bigger notes.. 25k 10k and 5K.. anyone who has been in this investment knows what it means when they say dropping the 3 zeros.. I do not think all the gurus are puposely scamming us and giving us wrong information.. CAUSE I BELIEVE if they are.. Well GOD Help them. IF we lose what little money we invested well my GOD says you reap what you sew... GOD HELP THEM if that is there intentions.. we will recover.. I cant say the same for them. I would like to hear what Night and Steve1 have to say they have not posted in quite awhile. I do not follow Adam Montana and Mailman.. I think Adam, is just trying sell his book and certainly don't believe his .10 per dinar.. Well this is just my opinion.. I will keep praying to our LORD and hope that he allows this to happen for us before Christmas.. GOD BLESS

by warvet91 Wed Dec 21, 2011 3:39 pm

Apples and oranges and a failure to grasp the big picture ... There is nothing critical about this analysis ...

by Alchemist Wed Dec 21, 2011 4:48 pm

sunstarhb wrote:Alchemist,

Do you agree?

*Big sigh*

What I think is irrelevant, what you believe is important.
I don't know, you know.

What I believe is that the 'blessing of the IQD' can very easily become a trap or stumbling block to actively doing something to improve one's future.

by **Kevind53** Wed Dec 21, 2011 5:04 pm

I will second Alchemist ... RV is not your provision, God is, if and when this does RV it will be a blessing, until then study to show yourself approved, do all things as to the Lord, and proclaim the Kingdom. Put God first, and let Him worry about the rest.

by pathfinders Wed Dec 21, 2011 5:26 pm

ISAIAH 40:31 BUT THEY THAT WAIT UPON THE LORD SHALL RENEW THEIR STRENGTH; THEY SHALL MOUNT UP WITH WINGS AS EAGLES; THEY SHALL RUN, AND BE WEARY; AND THEY SHALL WALK, AND NOT FAINT.

LUKE 6:38 GIVE AND IT SHALL BE GIVEN UNTO YOU; GOOD MEASURE, PRESSED DOWN, AND SHAKEN TOGETHER, AND RUNNING OVER; SHALL MEN GIVE INTO YOUR BOSOM. FOR WITH THE SAME MEASURE THAT YE METE WITHAL IT SHALL BE MEASURED TO YOU AGAIN.

PATHFINDER

by Alchemist Wed Dec 21, 2011 6:19 pm

"All I can say is read your BIBLE. This is Biblical FOLKS.. Like I tell everyone.. I'm either going to look like a Genuis or a complete idiot. I'll take my chances..I'm a dinar holder, I've done my own research as well as several others I know and I believe this will happen."

I have a few more minutes than I though before I leave. I am curious what you have from the Bible that proves this. Please feel free to pm me the scriptures, respond in this thread or create a new thread to explain. I am not asking for a debate, just curious on your interpretation.

Smile

bwest wrote:All I can say is read your BIBLE. This is Biblical FOLKS.. Like I tell everyone.. I'm either going to look like a Genuis or a complete idiot. I'll take my chances..I'm a dinar holder, I've done my own research as well as several others I know and I believe this will happen. Yes there are a lot of scams out there but I do not think this is a scam. There are so many people out there that don't believe this can happen. Look at the news, where is this money coming from for EU and the US just passed a 1 trillion dollar spending budget.. if we are broke how does this happen?? Where is this money coming from people? Theres a lot of misdirection and just flat out BS news from this clowns article.. (not the guy who posted the article) and the media. This is going to happen.. You are blessed and highly favored. I don't know when.. I hope soon. Life is about TAKING RISKS.. whether its in a marriage, an investment..ect...every dinar holder has taken a risk.

I hope the rate is high but think it will be around 3.50... just guessing here like the rest of us. I do not believe .10 or even .86., nor do I believe 8-9 dollars.. it has to be at least 1 to 1. No I'm not a guru.. I have no contacts, just my own opinion and research.. I think the people figuring it low are just complete idiots... dropping the 3 zeros doesnt mean .86.. right now it shows. .00086..... they are talking about gettting rid of the bigger notes.. 25k 10k and 5K.. anyone who has been in this investment knows what it means when they say dropping the 3 zeros.. I do not think all the gurus are puposely scamming us and giving us wrong information.. CAUSE I BELIEVE if they are.. Well GOD Help them. IF we lose what little money we invested well my GOD says you reap what you sew... GOD HELP THEM if that is there intentions.. we will recover.. I cant say the same for them. I would like to hear what Night and Steve1 have to say they have not posted in quite awhile. I do not follow Adam Montana and Mailman.. I think Adam, is just trying sell his book and certainly don't believe his .10 per dinar.. Well this is just my opinion.. I will keep praying to our LORD and hope that he allows this to happen for us before Christmas.. GOD BLESS

by Guest Wed Dec 21, 2011 9:04 pm

The above article gives not one shred of proof its a scam. It gives not one shred of proof the Iraq Dinar is going to devalue. In fact, it has gained in value over the last 8 years and it moves up and down with the exchange markets about 2%. If it were a scam, the sellers would be in jail and these sites would be shut down. Its Co-Intell-Pro at its best and pure opinion. One good thing we do know for sure, the Iraq Dinar has value. AJ

by Perimeter Force Wed Dec 21, 2011 9:21 pm

I would rather blow $300.00 and find out it is not true, than not invest

$300.00 and find out the RV was ...........$0.50= $125,000.00. or even $0.10 and $25,000.

Some might spend $100.00 to $200.00 per month just on coffee, so the risk is low. Potential high.

If I did my research right, I believe the IQD up from 1932 to about 1990 was in the $3.00 range. Why would it not return to at least .86 to $1.00 ?

Also last spring the IRS changed the rules that at a cashin at a currency dealer you could not transfer cashed in Dinars ledger to ledger. Even involving a branch bank it was required to by wired through the Federal Reserve, etc.

The IRS doesn't monitor wallpaper...they must think something is going on or going to happen.

Hey John Jagerson if it never RVs I've the grace to eat crow, but do you have the courage to say your wrong and realize financially your really blew it ? JMHO

by yoursoulknows Wed Dec 21, 2011 10:25 pm

Here's my take, for what it's worth.

When I first heard of the dinar I wouldn't even look at it seriously - after all - if it sounds "too good to be true - it probably is" - right?

When I first looked at the dinar seriously I thought my friend had been scammed - for sure - and told her so... after all - people had been waiting and saying the same thing for years, right?

When I realized the uniqueness of the Iraq situation, and realized this was a super rich country, NOT a corporation, NOT shares or dividends in a company, and therefore could not be 'folded', bankrupted, or mismanaged by 'people' in the company - that's when I was convinced. The investment was not some 'dot com', nor was it Internet based, nor some 'perceived' and 'false' value asset - it was based on hard assets (commodities) within this country though it's abundant oil supplies, gas, minerals and more...

Today I believe that the revaluation of the IQD is far more than just about the 'currency of Iraq', it is a global event, a global re-set of the world financial system, thus has far more moving pieces than I will ever know... (I mean: more people involved, more countries involved, more power involved and more money involved than I will ever know) Thus I understand there are countless unknown reasons this has not yet occurred. I understand it is unlikely to 'fix' the worlds troubles but will likely be the 'start' in turning the world economy around towards a better path....

The speculation/risk I've taken is as follows: The country and region is unstable, both politically and financially - meaning things could go wrong... or it could never happen depending on factors I have no control over. (That is why - if/when it happens - I'm out asap) The other speculation/risk involved, imo, is the uncertainty of when things will be 'ready' for it to happen... the date is unknown, the rate is unknown. In the event the revaluation does not occur I'm certain the value of the dinar will go up in time, regardless. The other risk/speculation is that I lose my funds.... not a large amount in the scope of life.

The biggest risk I see is the emotional aspect. The amounts are so huge that each of us have huge emotion riding on this RV, it will change each of our lives. THAT is difficult to let go of and, if it didn't happen, it would be by far the hardest aspect to get over.

However - my faith in God gives me strength. If it were to happen, God will guide me. If it were to not happen, God will guide me. My faith also adds another dimension to the investment, it's something many of us have (faith) and difficult to explain to those who have little or none... the dimension Faith adds is a certainty some may call fanaticism. Many think we have faith cos we 'want it so much to happen' - but I believe it is faith that allowed me/us to participate... to be guided to the opportunity - and it's my faith that gives me courage to be patient.

There are so many facts I can point to that show this is real... the biggest is some of the people involved guiding us - like Phoenix, Lakehouse, Randy K, Breitling, - people that are far smarter than me who are certain about the investment, and give us all great hope.

In closing it is also encouraging that 'mainstream' is not talking about this, the media is denying this will happen, big so called 'serious' investors call this a scam cos they are too snobbish or too close minded to the understanding there is much going on in this world that is hidden from us.... this is a good thing for proving we are likely correct in believing this will happen.

Cheers, YSK

by **Kevind53** Wed Dec 21, 2011 11:01 pm

For me the biggest proof is we prayed and asked God for wisdom, felt we were to do it, stepped into it in faith and then received confirmation, no once but twice from different sources that knew nothing of the investment ... On kept hearing something about "dinner time" but said it didn't sound quite like dinner ... I'm all over that ... yea baby, I say DINAR RV TIME!

Very Happy

8)

by Alchemist Thu Dec 22, 2011 12:38 am

I think YSK expresses the greatest issue very clearly:

"The biggest risk I see is the emotional aspect. The amounts are so huge that each of us have huge emotion riding on this RV, it will change each of our lives. THAT is difficult to let go of and, if it didn't happen, it would be by far the hardest aspect to get over."

There are no guarantees. Understanding the extent that money is manipulated, it could work for or against us. Many grow tired of unverifiable 'intel' that seems to never work out. If it didn't RV, how would you recover? Why not start 'recovering' right now and let the RV take care of the RV? Start building now instead of resting your whole future on paper? Then, when/if it RV's, you will be in a much better space to administer the funds.

A little dose of 'realism' or potential worst case scenario consideration is necessary to balance the one sided it's gonna RV lickity split lines we hear daily. I know a family that has their entire family nest egg of over 60,000 USD wrapped up in this. They thought it would RV summer before last. Most are not facing the real loss of their assets, though, just the realization or loss of a dream as YSK so eloquently expressed.

Be careful with your money.

by yoursoulknows Thu Dec 22, 2011 1:21 am

That is exactly where it started for me... which is, like you say, the biggest proof. After praying for God's wisdom my girlfriend called again about the dinar, her third time in 4 months... well said! YSK

Kevind53 wrote:For me the biggest proof is we prayed and asked God for wisdom, felt we were to do it, stepped into it in faith and then received confirmation, no once but twice from different sources that knew nothing of the investment ... On kept hearing something about "dinner time" but said it didn't sound quite like dinner ... I'm all over that ... yea baby, I say DINAR RV TIME!

8)

by yoursoulknows Thu Dec 22, 2011 1:43 am

You are so wise Alchemist.... this is the biggest risk to us all. My family is invested (my kids and I) fairly well by some standards. However - we are also dreaming of it, counting on it, we've made many mistakes because of thinking it would happen at certain times (ex: neglected responsibilities, neglected our other incomes, wasted hours listening to intel etc etc etc) NOT a good thing, and even now, we have the emotional investment still 'strong'... what will happen if doesn't happen? I know we'll be OK, but it would be a huge struggle - both emotionally and financially - for us.

Yet we have no regrets about the mistakes made as other huge and far more important realizations were made during the last 14 months.... realizations about God, about the purpose of life, about ourselves and about appreciation of what we've already been given, about kindness and patience... I will never forget this experience, regardless of the outcome, at this point. Because what we have gone through has given us even more than the revaluation will give us... joy and happiness within knowing this is only a temporary life with many tests - the RV (or none RV) being one of those tests.

Being able to express myself in dinar forums, hopefully helping others, definitely helping myself and having this 'group' experience has been good, and my soul knows I would not exchange it for the world, regardless of outcome, at this point of peace with the investment. Thanks for allowing me to share, YSK

Alchemist wrote:I think YSK expresses the greatest issue very clearly:

"The biggest risk I see is the emotional aspect. The amounts are so huge that each of us have huge emotion riding on this RV, it will change each of our lives. THAT is difficult to let go of and, if it didn't happen, it would be by far the hardest aspect to get over."

There are no guarantees. Understanding the extent that money is manipulated, it could work for or against us. Many grow tired of unverifiable 'intel' that seems to never work out. If it didn't RV, how would you recover? Why not start 'recovering' right now and let the RV take care of the RV? Start building now instead of resting your whole future on paper? Then, when/if it RV's, you will be in a much better space to administer the funds.

A little dose of 'realism' or potential worst case scenario consideration is necessary to balance the one sided it's gonna RV lickity split lines we hear daily. I know a family that has their entire family nest egg of over 60,000 USD wrapped up in this. They thought it would RV summer before last. Most are not facing the real loss of their assets, though, just the realization or loss of a dream as YSK so eloquently expressed.

Be careful with your money.

by ruthie23 Thu Dec 22, 2011 5:44 am

That is the biggest mistake imo KYS, the emotion.

Said it before and will say it again, the only things that I get emotional about are people and animals, and not necessarily in that order!

Making any emotional decision on the basis of money, is the first step to turmoil, and desperation is never a good place to start with speculation.

I am truly concerned for people who are in dire straits that is sad.

As to a family putting all their eggs into this basket, 60k I would have thought was slightly excessive, but each to their own, personally I would be more than happy to have bought a couple of foreclosed properties, maybe more in the States from what I have read about prices over there, and had a nice little rental income from that amount by now. Then spent some of that on dinar.

Hope you have a really Happy and Peaceful Christmas. :rendeer:

by NC227B Thu Dec 22, 2011 6:22 am

EXCELLENT.....ALL THE WAY THROUGH....every dinar holder should read !

The level of frustration continues to rise...yet many will not read or hear unless it comes from an ego-pumped guru. Some may bounce very hard on the ground next week.

Personnally, I've invested years and a decent amount of money. I want this as much as any, but the grounds get shakier and shakier. Prayers for all concerned !

by bwest Thu Dec 22, 2011 8:11 am

ALchemist.. its in there.. It doesn't specifically say anything about dinar...why woud it.... but it says alot about Iraq and how they will grow to become an economic POWER.....give me a few hours.... I'm getting ready for work... get back on at about 9am cst.. I'll post what I have

by Alchemist Thu Dec 22, 2011 8:58 am

I am totally impressed with the maturity on exhibit in this thread, as well as patience and wisdom.

by **Purpleskyz** Thu Dec 22, 2011 9:04 am

YSK and Alchemist.....

It is so refreshing to read your words of logic. Balance is always appreciated!

Though I hope this RV really happens and happens soon, after watching this mornings news from Iraq one really has to open their eyes to what was left unfinished by the UN/US over there. They do not have an infrastructure, limited electricity, limited schools, hospitals, etc. I thought that we were supposed to handle that for them BEFORE we left, seeing as how all that and more was in place there before we blew it off their map. Now I am not trying to be a "Debbie Downer" but come on folks..... Lets get real here.

by bwest Thu Dec 22, 2011 10:05 am

IRAQ (Babylon!)

The Bible warns of a coming judgment upon Babylon (modern Iraq) and says Iraq (Babylon) will rise again as a great "global economic" and "global religion" center ... and then will be utterly destroyed and left uninhabitable.

In the Old Testament (Tanakh), great prophecies against Iraq (Babylon) are found in the books of Isaiah 13:1-22 and Jeremiah 51:1-64 ... and also in Zechariah 5:1-11 (where Babylon is called by its ancient name "Shinar".) In the New Testament we find a fearful prophecy against "Mystery Babylon" in the book of Revelation chapters 17-18 (in the Bible a "mystery" is something that had not yet been revealed in Scripture.)

The Bible warns the prophecies against Iraq (Babylon) will be fulfilled in 3 Phases . . .

PHASE 1: Iraq (Babylon) would be invaded and conquered by a coalition of many nations led by a nation and leader from "a far country"... "the end of heaven" (the opposite side of the Earth) ... This Bible prophecy does not describe the Persian (and Medes) invasion of Babylon when Cyrus the Great conquered Babylon in 539 BC (the Persians diverted the Euphrates river and entered Babylon through the river bed gates on the night of October 12 without damaging the city ... many of the citizens did not even know they had been conquered for several days) ...
But, this Bible prophecy does (very accurately and remarkably) describe the Gulf War I + Gulf War II invasions of Iraq (Babylon) ... and remember, Saddam Hussein even described himself as the new Nebuchadnezzar (the famous ruler of ancient Babylon) ...

PHASE 2: Iraq (Babylon) will then rise to become the great economic and religious center of the world ... filled with evil and wickedness ... The "Woman" of Revelation 17:1-18 and Zechariah 5:1-11 ... "The Woman who rides the Beast"... "MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND OF THE ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH" ... is the coming evil and powerful religious system which will rise along with a powerful and evil "centralized" political-economic system under the leadership of the coming Antichrist (a powerful and popular world leader who will rise ... a Satanic empowered counterfeit Messiah.) The Bible warns at the time of the coming Antichrist and just before Armageddon, Iraq (Babylon) will become the economic and religious heart of the world. The coming Antichrist (who will rise in power over 10 nations which we are told were all once part of the ancient Roman Empire) will shift the center of the coming "global economic" system and the center of the coming enforced "global "The Abominations of the Earth" ... study Revelation 17:1-18 and Zechariah 5:1-11) to Iraq (Babylon) under his control and under the control of his powerful "religious" partner ..."the Second Beast" of Revelation 13:11-12.)
As a note, it now appears the world is busily preparing the way for this Phase 2 . . .

PHASE 3: Southern Iraq (Babylon) will be utterly destroyed ... left uninhabitable ... forever! The Bible warns Iraq (Babylon) ..."Shall be as when God overthrew Sodom and Gomorrah" ... "it shall never be inhabited" ... "neither shall it be dwelt in from generation to generation" ... "Babylon will become a heap of rubble" ... "haunted by jackals" ... "it will be an object of horror and contempt" ... "without a single person living there."

Note:This will take place at the time of the coming "Apocalypse" and Armageddon.
From the book of Revelation (the "Apocalypse") . . .

"After these things (after the rise of the Antichrist, the global economic system, and global religion ...)
I saw another angel coming down from Heaven,
having great authority,
and the Earth was illuminated with his glory.
And he cried mightily with a loud voice, saying,
"Babylon the great is fallen,
is fallen and has become a dwelling place of demons,
a prison for every foul spirit,
and a cage for every unclean and hated bird!
For all the nations have drunk
of the wine of the wrath of her fornication,
the kings of the Earth have committed fornication with her,
and the merchants of the Earth have become rich
through the abundance of her luxury."
(Revelation 18:1-3)

"Therefore her plagues will come in one day --
death and mourning and famine.
And she will be utterly burned with fire,
for strong is the Lord God who judges her.
The kings of the Earth who committed fornication
and lived luxuriously with her
will weep and lament for her,
when they see the smoke of her burning,
standing at a distance for fear of her torment, saying,
'Alas, alas, that great city Babylon, that mighty city!
For in one hour your judgment has come.'
And the merchants of the Earth will weep and mourn over her,
for no one buys their merchandise anymore:
merchandise of gold and silver,
precious stones and pearls,
fine linen and purple, silk and scarlet ..."
(Revelation 18:8-12)

Prophecies of Iraq (Babylon) From Isaiah and Jeremiah . . .

Isaiah 13:1-22 . . . The Burden Against Babylon (Iraq)

This prophecy was written by the prophet Isaiah around 700 BC, over 2,700 years ago. A complete scroll of the book of Isaiah was found among the Dead Sea Scrolls (over 2,100 years old) and is now on full public display in its entirety (including these passages), in a glass case in Israel, for all to see. Also, for those of you who may have any doubts about Babylon (ancient name) and Iraq (modern name) being synonymous, simply go to Babylon News, the official web news-site of Iraq, which is currently run (now was run) by Saddam Hussein's son, Uday Hussein . . .

Although Babylon (southern Iraq) was conquered by the Medes and the Persians in ancient times, it was conquered in such a way it was never destroyed ... in fact, in the past the great city of Babylon was spared (and used ) by its conquerors, including both Persia and Greece. Today, Saddam Hussein (and now others since Saddam Hussein was toppled and executed) have spent hundreds of millions of dollars restoring the ancient city of Babylon, including the palace where the prophet Daniel served and interpreted the "handwriting on the wall" the night before the Persians conquered the city (by sneaking in quietly under the river gates.)

So, the total destruction of Iraq (Babylon) as clearly prophesied in the Bible . . . is still future!

This prophecy against Iraq is fascinating ... and timely. Scoffers and skeptics should take note, for God says He uses prophecy to prove He is who He says He is. The details in this series of prophecies are both remarkable . . . and hard to ignore. (As you might notice, I wrote much of this Bible Prophecy study before the fall of Saddam Hussein ... which shows this Bible prophecy is now clearly "in process" and on schedule.)

What does God say concerning "The burden against Babylon (Iraq)?"

God first sends a warning to Iraq . . .

"The burden of Babylon (Iraq),
which Isaiah the son of Amoz did see (meaning this is prophetic)
Lift ye up a banner upon the high mountain,
exalt the voice unto them,
shake the hand, that they may go into the gates of the nobles. (Warn them judgment is coming)
I have commanded my sanctified ones,
(Sanctified means 'set aside,' much like the word 'holy'... it is where we get the word 'saint.')
I have also called my mighty ones for mine anger, (this will be no mere skirmish)
even them that rejoice in my highness." (God is calling those who still believe in Him in faith ...)
(Isaiah 13:1-3)

God warned He would one-day gather MANY nations against Iraq (Gulf War I + II?) . . .

"The noise of a multitude in the mountains,
like as of a great people;
a tumultuous noise of the kingdoms of nations gathered together:
the LORD of Armies (hosts) musters the armies (host) of the battle."
(Isaiah 13:4) (God was in control ...)

Study your history books (and Bible) ... ancient Babylon was conquered by just TWO nations (the Medes-Persians led by Cyrus the Persian) ... without firing a shot! Now, study (and watch the news videos) of the Iraq (Gulf) War I & II ... the combined "coalition" of nations surrounding and invading Iraq was massive!

The armies will come from "a far country"... "the end of heaven" . . .

"They come from a FAR country,
from the end of heaven, (the US is almost on the opposite side of the globe from Iraq)
even the LORD, and the weapons of his indignation,
to destroy the whole land."
(Isaiah 13:5)

Look at a globe ... and look where the US is compared to Iraq (Babylon) ... then study your history books.

by Alchemist Thu Dec 22, 2011 10:12 am

The U.S. probably spent as much on Blackwater/Xe as it did on infrastructure. I think they are praying that infrastructure needs will be met by the influx of investors. That is dependent on stability. The U.S. unwittingly made Iraq a target of Iranian insurgency. The more we beat war drums the more our imperial endeavors will be sabotaged. That is why I hope the common person will awake and quit giving power to those who work towards war. Everything is connected. We each have to consider what it means. We surely will get little unbiased news from the networks. We have to be wise.

by Alchemist Thu Dec 22, 2011 10:26 am

Bwest,

With regards to Revelation 17:9, "And here [is] the mind which hath wisdom. The
seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth," how does it fit in? No offense to anyone Catholic, but some have interpreted this as Rome because of the cartography of the out lying areas around Rome. Just curious your take on that, also, the extent to which things in Revelations should be taken literally verses allegorically.

by Alchemist Thu Dec 22, 2011 10:30 am

Sorry, double post issues.

by Alchemist Thu Dec 22, 2011 10:37 am

GENERAL MOD REMINDER:

BE CAREFUL HOW THE ISSUE OF RELIGION AND PROPHECY IS APPROACHED. THESE ARE TYPICALLY VOLATILE SUBJECTS. DON'T BASH OTHER RELIGIONS. JUST BE CAREFUL HOW YOUR MESSAGE IS CONVEYED. THIS IS A GENERAL REMINDER NOT DIRECTED TO ANYONE IN PARTICULAR.

Sambo:

Sambo wrote:I WOULD ALSO LIKE TO SAY THAT THIS SITE WAS BUILT ON CHRISTIAN FAITH BUT WE RESPECT ALL RELIGIONS.

WE WILL NOT TOLERATE NEGATIVE OR BASHING REMARKS TOWARDS ANY RELIGION - YOUR FAITH IS BETWEEN YOU AND GOD.

NEGATIVE OR BASHING REMARKS TOWARDS ANY MEMBER OR THIER RELIGION WILL BE GROUNDS FOR INSTANT AND PERMANENT BANNING.

CHOOSE YOUR WORDS CAREFULLY - THE WORDS YOU POST COULD BE YOUR LETTER OF RESIGNATION FROM OUR SITE.

THE CHOICES YOU MAKE TODAY - DICTATE THE LIFE YOU LEAD TOMORROW

THANKS
SAMBO

by Searay 32 Thu Dec 22, 2011 10:38 am

Read this before you invest. If you invest be wise. Once you invest set your limit. How much can you afford to let sit for a period of time. If it happens, it happen. Your gain. Don't go crazy.

by Alchemist Thu Dec 22, 2011 10:47 am

Thank you for sharing!

bwest wrote:
IRAQ (Babylon!)

The Bible warns of a coming judgment upon Babylon (modern Iraq) and says Iraq (Babylon) will rise again as a great "global economic" and "global religion" center ... and then will be utterly destroyed and left uninhabitable.

In the Old Testament (Tanakh), great prophecies against Iraq (Babylon) are found in the books of Isaiah 13:1-22 and Jeremiah 51:1-64 ... and also in Zechariah 5:1-11 (where Babylon is called by its ancient name "Shinar".) In the New Testament we find a fearful prophecy against "Mystery Babylon" in the book of Revelation chapters 17-18 (in the Bible a "mystery" is something that had not yet been revealed in Scripture.)

The Bible warns the prophecies against Iraq (Babylon) will be fulfilled in 3 Phases . . .

PHASE 1: Iraq (Babylon) would be invaded and conquered by a coalition of many nations led by a nation and leader from "a far country"... "the end of heaven" (the opposite side of the Earth) ... This Bible prophecy does not describe the Persian (and Medes) invasion of Babylon when Cyrus the Great conquered Babylon in 539 BC (the Persians diverted the Euphrates river and entered Babylon through the river bed gates on the night of October 12 without damaging the city ... many of the citizens did not even know they had been conquered for several days) ...
But, this Bible prophecy does (very accurately and remarkably) describe the Gulf War I + Gulf War II invasions of Iraq (Babylon) ... and remember, Saddam Hussein even described himself as the new Nebuchadnezzar (the famous ruler of ancient Babylon) ...

PHASE 2: Iraq (Babylon) will then rise to become the great economic and religious center of the world ... filled with evil and wickedness ... The "Woman" of Revelation 17:1-18 and Zechariah 5:1-11 ... "The Woman who rides the Beast"... "MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND OF THE ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH" ... is the coming evil and powerful religious system which will rise along with a powerful and evil "centralized" political-economic system under the leadership of the coming Antichrist (a powerful and popular world leader who will rise ... a Satanic empowered counterfeit Messiah.) The Bible warns at the time of the coming Antichrist and just before Armageddon, Iraq (Babylon) will become the economic and religious heart of the world. The coming Antichrist (who will rise in power over 10 nations which we are told were all once part of the ancient Roman Empire) will shift the center of the coming "global economic" system and the center of the coming enforced "global "The Abominations of the Earth" ... study Revelation 17:1-18 and Zechariah 5:1-11) to Iraq (Babylon) under his control and under the control of his powerful "religious" partner ..."the Second Beast" of Revelation 13:11-12.)
As a note, it now appears the world is busily preparing the way for this Phase 2 . . .

PHASE 3: Southern Iraq (Babylon) will be utterly destroyed ... left uninhabitable ... forever! The Bible warns Iraq (Babylon) ..."Shall be as when God overthrew Sodom and Gomorrah" ... "it shall never be inhabited" ... "neither shall it be dwelt in from generation to generation" ... "Babylon will become a heap of rubble" ... "haunted by jackals" ... "it will be an object of horror and contempt" ... "without a single person living there."

Note:This will take place at the time of the coming "Apocalypse" and Armageddon.
From the book of Revelation (the "Apocalypse") . . .

"After these things (after the rise of the Antichrist, the global economic system, and global religion ...)
I saw another angel coming down from Heaven,
having great authority,
and the Earth was illuminated with his glory.
And he cried mightily with a loud voice, saying,
"Babylon the great is fallen,
is fallen and has become a dwelling place of demons,
a prison for every foul spirit,
and a cage for every unclean and hated bird!
For all the nations have drunk
of the wine of the wrath of her fornication,
the kings of the Earth have committed fornication with her,
and the merchants of the Earth have become rich
through the abundance of her luxury."
(Revelation 18:1-3)

"Therefore her plagues will come in one day --
death and mourning and famine.
And she will be utterly burned with fire,
for strong is the Lord God who judges her.
The kings of the Earth who committed fornication
and lived luxuriously with her
will weep and lament for her,
when they see the smoke of her burning,
standing at a distance for fear of her torment, saying,
'Alas, alas, that great city Babylon, that mighty city!
For in one hour your judgment has come.'
And the merchants of the Earth will weep and mourn over her,
for no one buys their merchandise anymore:
merchandise of gold and silver,
precious stones and pearls,
fine linen and purple, silk and scarlet ..."
(Revelation 18:8-12)

Prophecies of Iraq (Babylon) From Isaiah and Jeremiah . . .

Isaiah 13:1-22 . . . The Burden Against Babylon (Iraq)

This prophecy was written by the prophet Isaiah around 700 BC, over 2,700 years ago. A complete scroll of the book of Isaiah was found among the Dead Sea Scrolls (over 2,100 years old) and is now on full public display in its entirety (including these passages), in a glass case in Israel, for all to see. Also, for those of you who may have any doubts about Babylon (ancient name) and Iraq (modern name) being synonymous, simply go to Babylon News, the official web news-site of Iraq, which is currently run (now was run) by Saddam Hussein's son, Uday Hussein . . .

Although Babylon (southern Iraq) was conquered by the Medes and the Persians in ancient times, it was conquered in such a way it was never destroyed ... in fact, in the past the great city of Babylon was spared (and used ) by its conquerors, including both Persia and Greece. Today, Saddam Hussein (and now others since Saddam Hussein was toppled and executed) have spent hundreds of millions of dollars restoring the ancient city of Babylon, including the palace where the prophet Daniel served and interpreted the "handwriting on the wall" the night before the Persians conquered the city (by sneaking in quietly under the river gates.)

So, the total destruction of Iraq (Babylon) as clearly prophesied in the Bible . . . is still future!

This prophecy against Iraq is fascinating ... and timely. Scoffers and skeptics should take note, for God says He uses prophecy to prove He is who He says He is. The details in this series of prophecies are both remarkable . . . and hard to ignore. (As you might notice, I wrote much of this Bible Prophecy study before the fall of Saddam Hussein ... which shows this Bible prophecy is now clearly "in process" and on schedule.)

What does God say concerning "The burden against Babylon (Iraq)?"

God first sends a warning to Iraq . . .

"The burden of Babylon (Iraq),
which Isaiah the son of Amoz did see (meaning this is prophetic)
Lift ye up a banner upon the high mountain,
exalt the voice unto them,
shake the hand, that they may go into the gates of the nobles. (Warn them judgment is coming)
I have commanded my sanctified ones,
(Sanctified means 'set aside,' much like the word 'holy'... it is where we get the word 'saint.')
I have also called my mighty ones for mine anger, (this will be no mere skirmish)
even them that rejoice in my highness." (God is calling those who still believe in Him in faith ...)
(Isaiah 13:1-3)

God warned He would one-day gather MANY nations against Iraq (Gulf War I + II?) . . .

"The noise of a multitude in the mountains,
like as of a great people;
a tumultuous noise of the kingdoms of nations gathered together:
the LORD of Armies (hosts) musters the armies (host) of the battle."
(Isaiah 13:4) (God was in control ...)

Study your history books (and Bible) ... ancient Babylon was conquered by just TWO nations (the Medes-Persians led by Cyrus the Persian) ... without firing a shot! Now, study (and watch the news videos) of the Iraq (Gulf) War I & II ... the combined "coalition" of nations surrounding and invading Iraq was massive!

The armies will come from "a far country"... "the end of heaven" . . .

"They come from a FAR country,
from the end of heaven, (the US is almost on the opposite side of the globe from Iraq)
even the LORD, and the weapons of his indignation,
to destroy the whole land."
(Isaiah 13:5)

Look at a globe ... and look where the US is compared to Iraq (Babylon) ... then study your history books.

by Alchemist Thu Dec 22, 2011 10:52 am

Searay 32 wrote:Read this before you invest. If you invest be wise. Once you invest set your limit. How much can you afford to let sit for a period of time. If it happens, it happen. Your gain. Don't go crazy.

Thanks. I might add, that if it turns out as well as some say, a hundred to a few hundred in USD's would dramatically change the life of most. I would rather have 100,000 in IQD than a down payment on a million in a gamble it will RV in 30 days. Be careful with your money.

by bwest Thu Dec 22, 2011 11:07 am

hey alchemist.. thanks for responding.. to answer your question from earlier. Honestly I don't have all the answers..Like most.. I'm a student when it comes to the Bible..very difficult to understand at times.. I did alot of research on this investment and for me... what ive posted and read was enough for me to invest in the dinar.. I don't know how others will Interpret what I posted... but hope it might give someone some sort of peace that they made the right decision to invest. With all the news in the media, I see this so clear I believe it is happenning now.. Like most we seek many counselors and pray to our Lord.. He put it on our hearts to invest so we wait, hope, pray and believe it will come to pass. I'm not prophet or a guru, just an average Joe.. a working man trying to survive like the rest of us. May GOD bless us all. I believe HE is preparing us, we are chosen by HIM and WHEN (not if) it comes to pass remember we all have a big responsibility to do what he asks of us. Come on RV..

by ruthie23 Thu Dec 22, 2011 11:14 am

Alchemist wrote:

Thanks. I might add, that if it turns out as well as some say, a hundred to a few hundred in USD's would dramatically change the life of most. I would rather have 100,000 in IQD than a down payment on a million in a gamble it will RV in 30 days. Be careful with your money.

And that should be the crux of the matter, well said.

There are amazing successes born from leveraging a relatively small amount, used wisely.

As the old saying goes, it's not what you've got, it's the way that you use it. That applies to money as much as personality.

by dinarling77 Thu Dec 22, 2011 11:59 am

Alchemist wrote:I am totally impressed with the maturity on exhibit in this thread, as well as patience and wisdom.

Well I hope not to bring you down, Alchemist, but I must comment on a couple of statements by bwest

bwest wrote:I hope the rate is high but think it will be around
3.50... just guessing here like the rest of us. I do not believe .10 or
even .86., nor do I believe 8-9 dollars.. it has to be at least 1 to 1.
No I'm not a guru.. I have no contacts, just my own opinion and
research.. I think the people figuring it low are just complete
idiots... dropping the 3 zeros doesnt mean .86.. right now it shows.
.00086..... they are talking about gettting rid of the bigger notes..
25k 10k and 5K.. anyone who has been in this investment knows what it
means when they say dropping the 3 zeros..

$3.50 certainly seems high to me based on what I paid for it - astronomical ROI
You are certain about the rate vs. LOPPING the zeroes from the currency HOW? I guess I'm one of the complete idiots you refer to. IMHO, if they lop it will be on the rate side, not on the currency side.

I do not follow Adam Montana and Mailman.. I think Adam, is just trying
sell his book and certainly don't believe his .10 per dinar.. Well this
is just my opinion.. I will keep praying to our LORD and hope that he
allows this to happen for us before Christmas.. GOD BLESS

Don't follow Mailman either, but perhaps you should follow Adam some. Have you ever read his book?

by Leliu5th Thu Dec 22, 2011 12:10 pm

I read Adams book, and he says you can cash in at any bank...well the Kuwaiti Dinar has revalued and is on the world market....my bank says they will not exchange it...so what makes the Iraqi Dinar so special??? confused

by Alchemist Thu Dec 22, 2011 12:23 pm

Dinarling,

This thread would have been a bashfest a month or two ago. Also, given holiday stresses, I think it is absolutely wonderful!!!

Smile

by dinarling77 Thu Dec 22, 2011 12:41 pm

Alchemist wrote:Dinarling,
This thread would have been a bashfest a month or two ago. Also, given holiday stresses, I think it is absolutely wonderful!!!

I'm trying my hardest to learn from my little doodoo lol!

by bwest Thu Dec 22, 2011 1:02 pm

Sorry I don't believe Adam and his .10 rv...

by dinarling77 Thu Dec 22, 2011 1:16 pm

bwest wrote:Sorry I don't believe Adam and his .10 rv...

Not trying to put you down bwest, I don't believe it either. His theory is very logical and makes a lot of sense from a business standpoint (with Iraq being the business). My big problem with that low of a rate is that I don't see how they could ever get the population to swap out their dinars for .10 per. I actually agree with your statement 1 for 1, but I think it may have to be 1.25 to lure the people into swapping out.

by bwest Thu Dec 22, 2011 1:28 pm

No I follow you.. didn't take it that way..... i wasn't trying to argue just throw my opinion out there..Yea.. with everything gong on in the news.. the EU, the 1 tillion dollar budget we just passed and what the US spent on the war.. .Again its all speculation.. right now with how much oil Iraq has and how rich they are .. .10 doesn't add up...i'd take .10 been in this way too long..

by Alchemist Thu Dec 22, 2011 1:30 pm

An RV at 1¢ would add ten fold to the investment. 10¢ would be one hundred fold profit and one dollar a thousand fold. Even at 1¢ hat's phenominal as far as returns go. It's not so much what ya have but what ya do with what ya have anyway...

by signman Thu Dec 22, 2011 2:22 pm

Now come on therealbutterfly you know that you are waiting for it to reval at $5.26.

by therealbutterfly Thu Dec 22, 2011 3:34 pm

signman wrote:Now come on therealbutterfly you know that you are waiting for it to reval at $5.26.

You know it!!! LOL

by **Kevind53** Thu Dec 22, 2011 4:16 pm

therealbutterfly wrote:
signman wrote:Now come on therealbutterfly you know that you are waiting for it to reval at $5.26.

You know it!!! LOL

I have 5.26 ... do I have 5.36? 5>36 bwbwbwbwbw 5.36 ... do I have 5.76?