Jester is looking at 2014 and THE RESET AND RV AND GCR WILL ALL HAPPEN AT ONCE.

10-29-2013 Intel Guru Jester THERE ARE MANY TRILLIONS OF DINAR OUT THERE...THE DINAR HAVE THEORETICALLY... BEEN DRASTICALLY OVERPRINTED...ONE REASON IS REVENUE...OUTSIDE THE COUNTRY WHICH IS WHERE THEY OVERSOLD IT IN THE FIRST PLACE...TO GET THE REVENUE TO START WITH...THEY DON'T REALLY WANT IT BACK...SO ENTER SOME OIL CREDIT SCENARIOS...THE DINAR DISAPPEARS IN COUNTRY WITH THE BUY BACK THEY ARE DOING...AND THE REST IS GONE BY WAY OF OIL CREDITS... AND THE CURRENCY CAN THEN BE WORTH A GREATER AMOUNT BECAUSE THERE IS LESS OF IT TO BE BACKED BY THEIR RESOURCES IN THE RESET...
 
I WILL TELL YOU THAT THERE IS NO WAY THAT ALL THE ASTRONOMICAL RATES BEING REPORTED IS GOING TO WORK. THE MATH JUST DOESN'T WORK... IT IS STILL POSSIBLE THAT A LOT OF MONEY GETS MADE BUT NOT AT WHAT IS BEING HYPED. THE REMOVING OF THE DINAR TO OIL CREDITS IS NOW THE PROBLEM. WHEN THEY REVALUE IT IS GOING TO BE FOR WHATEVER THEIR RESOURCES WILL BEAR BASED ON HOW MUCH GOT TAKEN CARE OF AND WHAT IS LEFT...AND THE RESET ITSELF...WILL HAVE A BEARING ON THAT VALUE.
 
IT DOES NOT MEAN THAT IT WILL NOT RV... BUT FOR THIS DISCUSSION I AM TRYING TO POINT OUT THAT THERE IS NO BASIS OF FACT IN WHAT WE ARE SEEING IN THE HIGH RATES THAT OTHERS ARE REPORTING...THE MATH JUST DOES NOT WORK. NOW TIMING WISE IRAQ HAS SAID...THEY WILL REMOVE THE 3 ZEROS IN EARLY 2014... SO THAT SEEMS TO BE THE TIMELINE. THE RESET AND RV AND GCR WILL ALL HAPPEN AT ONCE.
 
 
 
Read more: http://www.dinarguru.com/#ixzz2j7lBTYWj

After reading all those paragraphs.. I think he is basically saying that the rates that are being told will not work.. the math does not add up.. anyone else getting this?

Yea basically, and they don't. No way we will see 20+ like the gurus have been spouting. Between 3 and 4 dollars maybe, but 25.+???? No way!

He makes pretty good sense, and I would have to consider this a plausible scenario ... except for the GCR crapola.

So all the pumping that Bluegoof was doing before when he was saying 20 something himself is now false. Thanks for outing yourself Bluemongral you lying, sad sack, of feces.

Danarvictom wrote:So all the pumping that Bluegoof was doing before when he was saying 20 something himself is now false.  Thanks for outing yourself Bluemongral you lying, sad sack, of feces.

This was Jester not crapdog

When $3 or $1 are bantied about all the time, it makes 10 cents seem perfectly rational. Now some of the clowns are throwing out $25 or $30 rates so 10 cents seems, not only reasonable, but downright conservative. Yet mathematically, 10 cents is just as ridiculous as $30. A rate of 10 cents values Iraq's money supply at $8.5 trillion. A rate of 1 cent values it at $850 billion. So a nation with a GDP of $210 billion can support a money supply valued at $850 billion (and that's if the dinar RVs to just 1 cent)? That seems reasonable? It only seems reasonable if you have absolutely no understanding of what you're talking about. A money supply 4 times higher than the entire annual output of the nation is impossible! Are you kidding me? It's absurd. Pure idiocy.  So an increase of 3,500% to 35,000% (3 cents to 30 cents to match the few cents to few 10s of cents) is, according to some gurus "within proven macroeconomic principles" but the next 10x step to 350,000% (to $3) is preposterous. Plus of course the fantasy that a rising economy implies a rising exchange rate. Classic.

I am no economist, but I did some number crunching a while back and when you look at all of the factors, it does make sense. GDP is a part, money supply is a part as well, but there are other factors such as reserves, actual amount in circulation, etc. Their reserves are huge, much larger proportionally than the US holds. How much of the dinar is actually in circulation is an unknown factor. We can look at economic indicators such as their M2, but that does not tell us how much they have actually taken back in, how much is held in foreign reserves by countries like the US, or how much has actually been sold to investors. We can make some assumptions and estimates, but in the end, they are at best, good guesses. 

I don't have time now, but will try to dig up the info later, but IMO, an RV anywhere up to the $3.50 range is possible and reasonable. There are actually some pretty good reasons to expect an eventual value of the dinar in that range. There are also some wild cards that we just can't be sure of, but even if it lops and then RV's I believe we will see a decent profit.

1. Their reserves are not huge relative to their money supply. Their reserves are enough to back the M2 fully at around 1,000 to 1. That's a fact.

2. Who says they've "taken any back in" besides the gurus, which are known to be complete liars? The CBI says they are not only not taking in, they're PUTTING MORE OUT. That's what their ever increasing M1 and M2 numbers mean. You can verify these numbers right on the CBIs own website.

3. How much dinar is in circulation is not an "unknown factor". There is zero reason to believe the CBIs numbers are significantly incorrect. There are MANY reasons to believe that they ARE correct, such as:

a. Hundreds of millons of dinar for sale on eBay on any given day
b. Dinar trade sold half a trillion dinar in 2011 alone. That's one company, in one year.
c. The CBI says it is so.
d. The CBI has been independently audited, I think if the CBIs numbers were off by tens of trillions you'd probably have seen some news regarding it.
e. Why would they keep selling it at 1166 if they'd removed so much of it that it should be worth substantially more?
f. If they've removed so much of it, why hasn't the street rate in Iraq gone up? The Iraqis don't even think it's worth 1166, the street rate is usually 1200-1300, yet you think it's worth more than 3,000x that much? Why do you think you know so much more about Iraq than Iraqis?

4. The UST says they essentially hold zero dinar in reserves, according to the charges filed against the BHG group.  Do you have a better source that says otherwise? I'd be surprised if you did.  I haven't seen any.  The notion that ANY country on the planet would want to hold on to billions of dollars worth of currency of a country that is violent and unstable and who's only output is oil (which is sold in USD) is completely ridiculous. It makes zero sense.

5. 3.50 is not probable nor is it reasonable. I would even say impossible. It's ridiculous and insane. It makes zero sense whatsoever. It will never happen. The facts prove it. Their M0/M1/M2 proves it. The amount of dinar sold to suckers in the US alone proves it.  Respectfully, there is literally zero reason to think the dinar will appreciate even 1,000% over the next decade, let alone the 300,000% overnight that you're saying is "reasonable".

6. If it lops it is far more likely you will see an additional sizable loss, rather than a decent profit. People talk about lopping and then going to 3 dollars like it's the worst case scenario, which is nonsense. It's more likely to lose 10% in value after a lop than gain 200%+. Look at other lops and you will see this is a fact. Add in the massive spreads that most people have already paid, plus the even more massive spreads that you'll likely have to pay in order to "cash in" after a lop, and you're practically guaranteed to lose 40% or more of your "investment".

Every single piece of data related to reserves, M0, M1, M2 is right on the CBI's website. GDP data is on Wikipedia and countless other locations. None of it is secret or subject to interpretation. You don't have to assume or estimate anything. You don't have to guess on anything. Unfortunately, this is the essence of this scam. The clowns rely on the ignorance of their followers and subscribers regarding foreign currency exchange. But it isn't that hard. If common sense doesn't already tell you it's preposterous, a simple mathematical calculation will do the trick. Iraq has produced approximately 85 trillion dinar (rounded). They fix the exchange rate of their currency to the US dollar. Iraq currently maintains $70-75 billion in foreign cash reserves (rounded, converted to US dollars). 85 trillion divided by 72.5 billion equals 1,164.38. Guess what the fixed exchange rate to the US dollar should be? About 1,164.38. Shazam! It's unbelievable how willfully deceptive these clowns can be. If Iraq's reserves suddenly jump to $255 trillion then I suppose you could suggest the dinar exchange rate with the dollar should "reasonably" be $3. But since $255 trillion is more than 4 times the value of the entire world's money supply, I don't think we have to worry about it for a few centuries. LOL!  Not only will dinar investors not make money on a lop, they'll lose even more money. If a new currency is issued, how are existing dinar holders going to get their hands on it before their existing notes become invalidated? They're not going to fly to Iraq to do the exchange. They'll get them the same way they do now. They'll use these "money service" businesses that will rape them for another 10-20% to exchange their old notes for the new notes. But they'll do it enthusiastically because the clowns will tell them that is the final step before the mythical RV. They'll hype it up beyond comprehension. So, so sad.

I think I'll go look for Relix... 

Actually, there are strong indications that there is not a lot of IQD circulating in Iraq such as the frequent references to the need to "dedolarize" their economy. What we can't know is how much of the IQD is actually in circulation in Iraq.

Their reserves are indeed huge, Keep in mind that reserves are generally stated in USD, while M2 supplies are usually in the country's own currency. For comparison, they have roughly half of the US reserves, while our M2 is between 150 and 160X larger than theirs. Given that, I feel that it is indeed reasonable to expect a possible RV in the $3.50 range. Remember that reserves do not have to equal money supply.

There is much we do not and can not know, and this is still very much a high risk investment, but it is one that I am comfortable with. I may lose money, but I think the odds are better than even that I will turn a good profit eventually. I've done my homework, looked at the risks, and the potential. I continue to research and study, truthfully, I probably have spent more time studying this than I should have, but that's the way I am.

My only question is since you are so vehemently negative about this investment, why are you even here?

Just trying to keep it real.  I'm not on here that much but I do check in from time to time.  I have made some pretty good friends with some people here.  There are some good folks on this site.


As for "backing the Dinar with oil", it really doesn't work like that (and Iraq wouldn't want it to work like that). And even if it did, let's do the math:

- Iraq currently exports about 2.07m barrels of oil per day. (It may produce more, but it doesn't export it all as a large chunk is obviously consumed domestically (oil power stations, domestic transportation, construction, etc.)

"Iraq exported 62.1 million barrels of oil in September, or about 2.07 million barrels per day (bpd), the lowest daily average since February 2012".

http://www.iraq-businessnews.com/2013/10/28/oil-exports-plunge-to-19-mth-low

- 2.07m barrels of oil per day x 365 days x $97 current oil price = $73.3bn annual oil export revenue. (Again we're being generous and assuming a 0% rate of corruption or "missing" oil).

- 84,000bn Dinar money supply divided by $73.3bn = 1,146 years. That's how long it would take Iraq to export enough oil to "back" just today's 2013 money supply 1:1 (assuming it doesn't create a single Dinar from now until 3,159AD). If you use the absurd 1:3 (1 Dinar = $3), then it would take Iraq from now to 5,451AD to sell enough oil to raise enough $ to "give" everyone $3 for each Dinar currently in circulation.

- But there's just one problem - 1,146-3,438 years x 2m barrels per day = 836bn-2509bn barrels of oil in total. But Iraq only has about 152bn barrels of proven oil reserves (of which only about 100bn will be exportable after domestic consumption)...

And all that's ignoring the fact that much of Iraq's oil revenue pays for their domestic government budget, and is unavailable as FX reserves. Include that and you're talking virtual infinity since Iraq is already running a budget deficit ...

And that's the unrealistic reasoning of the "Iraq's $70 billion oil income will support" an $84,000 billion-$252,000 billion "RV" in a nutshell.

well sins ce the whole GCR/asset based currency scenario is crapola, your whole argument is a moot point. Iraq is not using, nor will they be using oil to support/back their currency. They will use fractional banking to leverage their reserves, just like we, and every other country in the world do.