When the RV Comes

by DTConcerned Tue Oct 18, 2011 8:57 pm

The UN Recognizes the Iraq currency as a viable up and coming international currency, but they will not post a real Rate change until it actually happens:
"Can not post links yet :-("
Just the fact IQD is being posted as having an operational exchange rate is a solid indication that it will become an international exchange currency. This chart will reflect that value change after it happens.

Don't be fooled by estimated rates for future planning. These are rates that are being used to make planning closer to ball park figures. "Can not post links yet :-(""
This site is as it says so that they can make future plans with an estimate of possible revalued dinar. An actual RV will supersede these rates. This is significant as we get links to contracts and budget information that is based on this standardized estimate until the currency really assumes it's true value, like: "Can not post links yet :-(""
or the Dam contract for 11 Bln IQD
These are based on feasibility estimates which will be lower then the actual RV in order to secure the feasibility of the project after the RV. If they did their estimates based on say 7 USD to 1 IQD and the RV came in at say 4 instead of 7 they would be way under budgeted and come up short on being able to pay off projects after the RV, so the estimate is low in order to insure the feasibility of being able to accomplish the end results post RV.
Thought I would do a preemptive post before someone tried posting the RV is going to be 1.134 or 1.168 USD to 1 IQD. Any post that states the RV is coming in this low or lower is bad intel based on official public documentation.
The feasibility article actually explains the justification for using a rate lower then 3.20 an accepted estimated rate of exchange, also not the RV rate.
You can not plan or estimate feasibility on "I don't know what it is worth" so they have set low-ball figures to be able to begin planning that has a reasonable chance of success.
The Rate will be absolutely higher then the Estimated feasibility rate and probably higher then the additionally quoted estimated rate, when the RV actually happens.

I am no Guru, and have no inside sources, this is not protected secret information, just using reasonable logic to analyze public information.

Based on the latest publicly available information, the IQD needs to come in at $3.86 USD for them to meet their budget

There is a common misconception that Iraq has to come up with the money to buy back all the IQD when they RV. First they will not have to buy any of it back from their own people, because that is the currency they will be using to buy and sell in their public markets, it will not do them any good if the government or the banks have it all. Second international treasuries are going to put IQD in their reserves to shore up the strength of their own currencies, they can not do that if the send it back to Iraq to cash it in. Third international countries will need to use IQD to purchase oil from Iraq business, if all of the IQD goes back to Iraq, then anyone who wants to buy from Iraq will first have to buy the currency back from Iraq, instead exchange banks will continuously maintain a holding of IQD for this purpose. Forth there will be international exchanging of IQD between big power countries, like the USA paying China debt with IQD. The more IQD a country has the more they can influence business and activities in Iraq. It will take years for the international IQD to make its way back to Iraq, if it ever does and the Iraq Treasury and CBI will not have to buy it back.

Below is a post that was posted awhile back and copied and repeated, that clearly explains how everyone will benefit from a higher RV, including Iraq(I think I got this from a Freeway Bill re post):

There were originally 30 trillion dinar printed. Well over 80% of that amount has been accounted for and is in the hands of Iraq. That leaves 6 trillion dinar out of which US, China, Russia, Brazil and other countries hold a substantial amount of these in their countries. So let us say that there is 1 – 1.5 trillion is out in the hands of regular people, trusts, etc.

How could Iraq possibly cash in this much at one time?
They can’t!
Or Can They?

China and the US have signed agreements that they each will take all of their dinar and all that they cash in from their citizens in OIL @ an agreed upon rate of $32.00 per barrel for however long it takes.Now taking the total of 6 trillion that is supposedly out there which would be multiplied by the rate that we will set at $ 4 just to go from a number of some kind.
So now we have $ 24,000,000,000,000! Seems like an amount that just will not be possible? Read on. 24 trillion dollars will transform to 750 BILLION barrels of oil @ $32.00. That is what it will cost Iraq to payoff. That is still a lot of money, right? Well, considering that one barrel of oil cost Iraq less than $ 2.00 per barrel to process which means that Iraq can pay off ALL of the Dinar still out for $ 1,500,000,000 while coming out of sanctions, becoming a powerful country and a part of the UN and WTO and go forward.

Being that this RV would basically make it so the US will be able to pay off most or all of their national debt along with the other countries involved would be doing the same making the World Economy would get a tremendous shot in the arm and everyone would be on a better playing field meaning World trade would be enhanced and the US and China emerge as the strongest and Iraq comes out as either the richest or the 2nd richest country in the world.

So, my friends, the RV can happen and actually if you take Iraq’s assets, it could actually justify RVing at upwards of $ 8 – $ 12 and this calculation would work and still leave Iraq with a smidgen of debt compared to the assets they have. So rest assured that there will BE NO LOP because it is not necessary and it would deflate this entire plan and not help anyone and Iraq would not emerge as a stable government or friend to anyone.

The point here is it is a win win for everyone for Iraq to RV in the mid-range of their potential. Shabibi has said they can support as high as $14.00. A range of $5.00 to $8.00 would give CBI the flexibility they need to address issues and protect against inflation and deflation with an ebb and tide of financial stability. I do not know what will be the rate, there may be one person in the world who does, or a few, but anyone who does is not going to let that piece of information leak out where it can go public.

There will be no LOP, there will be a reasonable RV.

Don’t ride the hype, use wisdom. Live life in the now, hope for the future, and use wisdom in dealing with the affairs of men.

by therealbutterfly Tue Oct 18, 2011 9:02 pm

No country revalues their money to balance their budget. So lets not use that guru bs anymore to justify any rate. Iraq bases the budget off oil, plain and simple.

by Guest Tue Oct 18, 2011 9:26 pm

Go rv and go higher rate Smile

by openmind Tue Oct 18, 2011 9:26 pm

You are very correct Mrs. Butterfly. If it were that easy, just revalue the Dollar and balance our budget. LOL!

by Feisty136 Tue Oct 18, 2011 9:45 pm

I like what DTConcerned has to say....but

I believe it will be one to one to start, then 90 days to cash in the three zero dinars, then it will RV to the moon...

My friend's brother-in-law who is a signatory for a three letter agency and works for another three letter agency, says RI first at about $3.22; then RV to over $5 90 days after...he said it will be adifferent rate for Iraq, as they are not allowed to bring out currency and they do not want people there too rich as they will leave...he did say RI the end of September too, however; now he says before end of year....

by Guest Tue Oct 18, 2011 9:52 pm

There is only one problem I have with the opinion. No country has to have IQD to buy oil from Iraq. All oil is settled world wide in USD, that is a known fact. AJ

by DTConcerned Tue Oct 18, 2011 9:52 pm

openmind wrote:You are very correct Mrs. Butterfly. If it were that easy, just revalue the Dollar and balance our budget. LOL!

The difference being, the dollar will not support the value, but the IQD will do way more then support the value. The minimum value required to support their budget is a frame of reference, not a basis for value. Official statements concerning the value would include "The Iraq dinar will be the strongest currency in the Middle east.", "It will have a true value by the beginning of the fiscal year.", "We will have the most powerful currency in the ME."

If we increase out GNP, wonder if we could RV the Dollar, ... the USA has more Oil Reserves then Saudi Arabia, China and Canada combined, ... the USA has prime agricultural land for growing hemp, a plant that could surplant the use of oil and cotton, ... sounds too good to be true, ...

by openmind Tue Oct 18, 2011 9:55 pm

AJAnderson wrote:There is only one problem I have with the opinion. No country has to have IQD to buy oil from Iraq. All oil is settled world wide in USD, that is a known fact. AJ

by Guest Tue Oct 18, 2011 9:56 pm

Feisty136 wrote:I like what DTConcerned has to say....but

I believe it will be one to one to start, then 90 days to cash in the three zero dinars, then it will RV to the moon...

My friend's brother-in-law who is a signatory for a three letter agency and works for another three letter agency, says RI first at about $3.22; then RV to over $5 90 days after...he said it will be adifferent rate for Iraq, as they are not allowed to bring out currency and they do not want people there too rich as they will leave...he did say RI the end of September too, however; now he says before end of year....

My intel is about the same and I hope they all are right.

by openmind Tue Oct 18, 2011 9:59 pm

DTConcerned wrote:
openmind wrote:You are very correct Mrs. Butterfly. If it were that easy, just revalue the Dollar and balance our budget. LOL!

The difference being, the dollar will not support the value, but the IQD will do way more then support the value. The minimum value required to support their budget is a frame of reference, not a basis for value. Official statements concerning the value would include "The Iraq dinar will be the strongest currency in the Middle east.", "It will have a true value by the beginning of the fiscal year.", "We will have the most powerful currency in the ME."

If we increase out GNP, wonder if we could RV the Dollar, ... the USA has more Oil Reserves then Saudi Arabia, China and Canada combined, ... the USA has prime agricultural land for growing hemp, a plant that could surplant the use of oil and cotton, ... sounds too good to be true, ...

About the dollar not supporting the RV, wouldnt that be the purpose of an RV?

About the official statements, they are not policy statements, but political banter.

About the hemp industry development in the USA, right on brother!

by DTConcerned Tue Oct 18, 2011 10:02 pm

AJAnderson wrote:There is only one problem I have with the opinion. No country has to have IQD to buy oil from Iraq. All oil is settled world wide in USD, that is a known fact. AJ

The USA already has an agreement to buy oil from Iraq with IQD.

He has already stated that there will not be a time limit set to turn in the big denominations, so Iraq is not going to get them back at that rate anyway. Also who would turn in all their IQD at 1 to 1 knowing it will go higher?

As far as a different rate inside Iraq from outside? Well, they would have to have a closed border policy that would be impossible to maintain to even try that, and the Electronic Purchasing cards would not be able to be used internationally either. That is a situation that would not be feasible by any stretch of the imagination. It would be a massive invitation to black marketeers.

by Feisty136 Tue Oct 18, 2011 10:10 pm

DTConcerned

I'm just telling all what a friend was told by his brother-in-law who does work for the treasury...and that is confirmed where he works, but who knows what they tell these guys...only a few people know I would imagine..

My friend says he was told that the brother-in-law worked on the RV "project" though...

I believe thaey can time limit the three zero denoms to get us non-elite to turn them in to the US Banks, who will hold them and profit more for the Elite...

by Feisty136 Tue Oct 18, 2011 10:14 pm

DTConcerned:

How do you know the US has an agreement with Iraq to buy oil with IQD

When did Shabbibi state no time limit?

I agree about different rate, cause from what I've read, most Iraqis are so poor and have no three zero dinars and live on a few dinars a day now, so big deal if they have 20,000 dinar saved and they all of the sudden have $60,000 USD...its a start, but they aren't leaving dodge with that...

by Feisty136 Tue Oct 18, 2011 10:16 pm

OPENMIND:

You're only 160 posts away from being the leader...don't be shy, I like what you say except when it's too political..

by therealbutterfly Tue Oct 18, 2011 10:22 pm

DTConcerned, you do know that their budget is based in DINAR. They quote the value in USD but its in dinar. They base their budget on a per barrel rate for oil and that projects their surplus or deficit. For the last several years they have always had a surplus. Which is why Shabbibi told the GOI to go stuff it when they wanted to borrow from the CBI to cover their deficit. He said go use your surplus from other years. So the whole rv to cover budget is bunk.

and as far as your comment about no time frame to turn in, show me where that was said. All the articles talking about redenomination all say 2 years to complete.

by openmind Tue Oct 18, 2011 10:25 pm

the definition of bunk is NON SENSE!

by DTConcerned Tue Oct 18, 2011 10:44 pm

and as far as your comment about no time frame to turn in, show me
where that was said. All the articles talking about redenomination all
say 2 years to complete.

When did Shabbibi state no time limit?

Sept 26 article, I can not post links yet. 2 years is a projected time frame, not a time limit. Just like $1000.00 USD bills were pulled out of circulation, but if you still have one, it is still valid currency, although probably worth more as a collectors item then as currency.

It is very hard for me to imagine that everyone who worked on the RV project knows the Rate, although leaks within that organization would be a great source to spread dis-information. I don't know, but that would be a logical conclusion.

About the dollar not supporting the RV, wouldnt that be the purpose of an RV?

actually NO, Iraq has Oil to support the revalue of their currency, US currency already has a value based on the GNP and supportability of its current value, so attempting to RV the USD right now would simply cause immediate rampant inflation until it gets back where it is.

How do you know the US has an agreement with Iraq to buy oil with IQD

I believe this was from articles as far back as April 2011, but I do not have a direct reference currently available. I will restate, that the information that I look to for most of what I present is public information. I have no special connections, I am not a "Guru" "information gatherer" I have no secret sources, just some common sense and some deductive reasoning.

Logic: If you just watched your friend eat Exlax brownies you may want to move out of his path. ...

by DTConcerned Tue Oct 18, 2011 10:59 pm

therealbutterfly wrote:DTConcerned, you do know that their budget is based in DINAR. They quote the value in USD but its in dinar. They base their budget on a per barrel rate for oil and that projects their surplus or deficit. For the last several years they have always had a surplus. Which is why Shabbibi told the GOI to go stuff it when they wanted to borrow from the CBI to cover their deficit. He said go use your surplus from other years. So the whole rv to cover budget is bunk.
.

Yes, a budget in Trillions of dinar which exceeds the current volume of printed Dinar. Previous years they have used the currency they have made off selling oil to pay and not paid in Dinar, but as they move forwards they are being obligated to pay internal budgets with Dinar, something that they will only have sufficient Dinar to do if the currency revalues. If they pay them wit dinar at the current rate, a $1000.00USD per week paycheck would be 1,117,000.00 Dinar and a $300,000.00 building would be 3.3 Trillion Dinar. This would be blatantly impractical, although possible until you reached the limit of printed dinar and who is going to sell them back dinar at a lower rate then what they might get post RV?

It also would not be practical for Shabibi to loan the government Dinar at the current value and then have the Government obliged to pay it back at the revalued rate. $100,000.00 USD value loan would then have to be paid back at (for arguments sake on a 1 - 1 rv rate) $111,700,000.00 USD Value (or higher as the value of the Dinar goes up).

by therealbutterfly Tue Oct 18, 2011 11:07 pm

What I am saying is their budget will change the dinar amt needed but still will be the same in USD. ($98bill usd). After it rv's then lets just say its a 1:1, then the budget will now be 98bill dinar instead of 115 trillion. They will still have a deficit because their budget is based on an $85 per barrel price and if oil is higher, then that takes \care of the deficit. The RV DOESNT change a thing with regards to the budget.

by ClermontThinker Wed Oct 19, 2011 12:10 am

HOLD UP my Dinarian brothers and sisters... Do NOT get on board the crazy train!!!

It is a shame that this incredible investment opportunity is demeaned by the charlatans and misinformation brokers. The highs and lows caused by the ridiculous amounts of misinformation can really wear on many of us on this roller coaster. The gurus and those starved for attention that continue to post opinions masked as intel is just inconsiderate.

Maybe I am wrong... But, I think it is important for everyone to understand that there is NOBODY... Absolutely nobody... That can or will post on this site or any other Dinar site that has a CBI contact, a three letter agency insider or even a close friend of your brother's college buddy's next door neighbor... That has the first bit of inside information on the GOI plan to RV the Dinar. Just take a moment to reflect and think...

This is a sound investment. A long shot?? You bet. But, there is an abundance of information that supports the RV possibility.

However, too often, there is unsupported information presented as fact. Too often, and we are all guilty of this, we do not do the research required to determine the validity of some of the information presented on the various sites, both forums and "news" sites. Too often we take the claims of information and intel from these clowns and the more often it is repeated the more traction it develops. BUT... The more you hear it does not make it any more factual.

Point in fact... The post by DTConcerned that began this thread, as well as the quote within the post, has some bad math. The assertion that the GOI would be able to tap into "... 750 BILLION barrels of oil..." in order to generate $24Trillion is both incorrect and impossible.

According to research reported in 2003 by the Brooking Institution the experts at the US Dept. of Energy estimates that the country of Iraq has proven oil reserves of "only" 112 barrels. A more optimistic estimate, presented by the Center for Global Energy Studies, estimates the Iraqi oil reserves at a heady 300 billion barrels. Conversely... The USGS (US Geological Survey) estimates that Iraq most likely has only 45 billion barrels of oil in the ground. The USGS also suggested that the Iraqi reserves could, possibly, be as meager as 14 billion barrels. So, as you can see for yourself... 750 billion barrels is far fetched, to say the least.
LINK: http://www.brookings.edu/papers/2003/0512globalenvironment_luft.aspx

As I have stated several times... I would LOVE to see the IQD come in at $3.00 or more... I am just not too sure that is possible. In fact, it is hardly plausible. Using the most conservative estimate that I can find... And trust me it is ONLY an estimate because this is another poin that is unknown. It is estimated that there are 7 trillion IQD in the hands of various investors. IF the exchange rate is $3.00 to 1 Dinar that would require $21 TRILLION USD to cash in the 7 trillion IQD. Again, flawed math. The numbers do not lie. The M1 money supply of the US, according to the FED is $2123 BILLION. M2 supply, again according to the FED is only $9586 BILLION. The United States, as you can clearly see, is woefully short of the funds required to facilitate the exchange at $3.00.
LINK: http://www.federalreserve.gov/releases/h6/hist/h6hist1.txt

Count me among those that believe that the GOI will RV the Dinar. However, we should be prepared for a rate that makes some sort of sense mathematically... Both for the investors in the US and of course, Iraq. It will take a good deal more than just wishful thing, some convoluted fractional formula or some guru claimed the screen are blinking flashing or pinging.

Stay strong, be wise and do your research.

Go RV!!!

by jbar Wed Oct 19, 2011 12:14 am

Dont forget about what either IMF or WB told them last week about thier budget. Paraphrase - You need to go back and reduce your budget because you have not factored in if price of oil goes below 85.00. Also, I would have to go look and see but I dont think thier constition allows them to have a deficiet, thats why they went to WB to ask for them to make up the difference.

JP

by openmind Wed Oct 19, 2011 12:15 am

When the RV happens, we will know it is fact. Until then, we hope and believe. Speculation and research is natural.

by topspin2 Wed Oct 19, 2011 12:30 am

[quote] There is only one problem I have with the opinion. No country has to have IQD to buy oil from Iraq. All oil is settled world wide in USD, that is a known fact. AJ

You may want to research that one a bit more....Russia and China are not trading oil and gas on the USD unless that has changed

by jbar Wed Oct 19, 2011 1:50 am

I believe that Russia and China are using other currency when buying from Iran. When they are buying from OPEC they are using USD to complete the transaction. Iran was one of two nations to conduct oil sales(from the ME) outside of US dollars since 1980. Take a wild and crazy guess who was the other and about when they did it. For OPEC oil sales since I believe 1973 all transaction have been conducted in USD as part of angreement in exchange for military protection, hence the reason we went to Kwait. That same agreement was renewed last year through 2017. My orginal date may be off a little it may have actually been earlier than 1973. This also exsplians why the US has been a reserve currency and why almost all nations hold it.

JP

by openmind Wed Oct 19, 2011 2:11 am

[quote="topspin2"]

There is only one problem I have with the opinion. No country has to have IQD to buy oil from Iraq. All oil is settled world wide in USD, that is a known fact. AJ

You may want to research that one a bit more....Russia and China are not trading oil and gas on the USD unless that has changed

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2009/oct/06/oil-us-dollar-threat-to-america

Oil is traded in dollars.

by pontymania Wed Oct 19, 2011 5:59 am

agree. They dont need IQD. They get paid in USD cash..

by ClermontThinker Wed Oct 19, 2011 9:25 am

@ Jbar

You are right about Iran getting paid in something other than USD. In fact, according to news reports (link to follow) Iran has stopped accepting the USD for any sort of transaction since 2009. The very anti-American president of Iran, Ahmadinejad, has even referred to the USD as a "worthless piece of paper..."
LINK: http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/04/30/business/main4057490.shtml

For instance, Indian pays for Iranian oil with their national currency the rupee.
LINK: http://www.uskowioniran.com/2011/07/india-to-pay-for-iran-oil-in-rupee.html

So... Though the world standard is USD it is apparent that the seller of the oil can require payment in whatever currency it desires.

by DTConcerned Wed Oct 19, 2011 1:02 pm

ClermontThinker wrote:HOLD UP my Dinarian brothers and sisters... Do NOT get on board the crazy train!!!

Point in fact... The post by DTConcerned that began this thread, as well as the quote within the post, has some bad math. The assertion that the GOI would be able to tap into "... 750 BILLION barrels of oil..." in order to generate $24Trillion is both incorrect and impossible.

According to research reported in 2003 by the Brooking Institution the experts at the US Dept. of Energy estimates that the country of Iraq has proven oil reserves of "only" 112 barrels. A more optimistic estimate, presented by the Center for Global Energy Studies, estimates the Iraqi oil reserves at a heady 300 billion barrels. Conversely... The USGS (US Geological Survey) estimates that Iraq most likely has only 45 billion barrels of oil in the ground. The USGS also suggested that the Iraqi reserves could, possibly, be as meager as 14 billion barrels. So, as you can see for yourself... 750 billion barrels is far fetched, to say the least.

As I have stated several times... I would LOVE to see the IQD come in at $3.00 or more... I am just not too sure that is possible. In fact, it is hardly plausible. Using the most conservative estimate that I can find... And trust me it is ONLY an estimate because this is another poin that is unknown. It is estimated that there are 7 trillion IQD in the hands of various investors. IF the exchange rate is $3.00 to 1 Dinar that would require $21 TRILLION USD to cash in the 7 trillion IQD. Again, flawed math. The numbers do not lie. The M1 money supply of the US, according to the FED is $2123 BILLION. M2 supply, again according to the FED is only $9586 BILLION. The United States, as you can clearly see, is woefully short of the funds required to facilitate the exchange at $3.00.

Stay strong, be wise and do your research.

Go RV!!!

OK, please reread everything. First off what was quoted was hypothetical IF all that Dinar was turned in for oil and as posted previously there will be a portion held back to strengthen the reserve in the UST. The hypothetical evaluation was showing how Iraq is not going to have to suddenly fork over payback for all the IQD that is out there. The purchase of Oil with IQD is not going to be a one year process and please do the research. And of course Iraq would not produce that much oil in a year, but as scientifically documented Oil is a renewable resource and if yo udon't pump from the reserve you waste the renewable factor like we are currenlty doing with most of the reserves in the USA. You pump it out and it fills back in, the renewal rate in the end will determine the maximum output rate.

So you account for between $11 & $12 Trillion between M1 and M2 currently in USA, do not over look there will be an increase in reserves as a result of the RV and the majority of currency is electronic not paper. Additionally not all Dinar will be turned in immediately and there will be a process and stages of Dinar being held by banks and transfers that will extend over a period of time that will balance. This will not be everyone cashing in for paper at their local banks.

Yes, Everyone needs to hold their groun and not go off the deep end, not because yo udon't understand what was presented, nor because someone wants 15 minutes of glory, but because the affairs of men are not set in stone and caution is required when taking risk. Balance is the key.

by ClermontThinker Wed Oct 19, 2011 6:12 pm

@ DTConcerned

Your points are well taken... However, again, your math and/or numbers are wrong.

The statement in your last post, "So you account for between $11 & $12 Trillion between M1 and M2 currently in US" is NOT what I state in my post at all. What I did post was this, "The M1 money supply of the US, according to the FED is $2123 BILLION. M2 supply, again according to the FED is only $9586 BILLION. " A far, far cry from any resembling $11 or $12 Trillion.

Though I understand the numbers you used might be estimates the numbers, themselves, are wildly out of line with the facts as we know them.

To suggest that oil is a "renewable resource" is, to be kind, a stretch. Please direct me to the "scientifically documented" info explaining the theory. Further, your suggestion that if the oil is not pumped from the ground the "renewable factor" is wasted is a concept that I have never heard of... But I would love to know more about the science behind both thoughts.

According to a document published by Stanford University the natural formation of petroleum deposits is estimated to take millions of years... From that document;
"Petroleum, commonly referred to as oil, is a natural fuel formed from the decay of plants and animals buried beneath the ground, under tremendous heat and pressure, for millions of years."
LINK: http://www.stanford.edu/group/west/exploringthewest/pdf/OilExtraction.pdf

Keep the faith...

Go RV !!!

by DTConcerned Wed Oct 19, 2011 7:59 pm

You can google "crude oil renewable resource" and find dozens of references. The US Geological survey would probably be the best one to look for. You will find old/obsolete information stating it is not, but you will also find that it is more universally accepted that is is a renewable resource, continuously produced by the earth. Of course an excellent alternative would be using the pulp core from hemp to produce crude oil which could be a readily renewable resource. Corn and other plant matter can also be used, with diminishing degrees of productivity. It does not take millions of years to turn this into Crude oil and for many products we look to petroleum for, you can by-pass turning them to crude and go more directly to the end product. The original Ford(car) body was made from Hemp and could take a beating from a sledge hammer and bounce back into form. The hemp industry was shut down by oil, wood and cotton money because it was a threat to their income. Wacky weed was just an excuse and method of implementing a scare tactic, fear campaign that was full of lies.
The Stanford link you provide is to a historical document that was actually posted as a pdf file in 2007, an archival resource, not current information.
Based on predictions from 1970, the middle east would run out of oil in 25 years based on current use at the time without allowing for increased use. Again in 1977 it was projected that the world would run out of oil before the year 2000 and this has not happened either. Russia was the first to actually discover that the earth was continuously producing oil and refilling the reserves. This is not hidden information, it is publicly accessible searching the internet. Yes there are sites that still clink to crude being a non-renewable resource, but they base their conclusions on obsolete data and ignore the fact that the worlds oil reserves keep filling back up. Besides how could oil barons keep fleecing everyone if people did not believe the supply might run out?

What I did post was this, "The M1 money supply of the US, according to
the FED is $2123 BILLION. M2 supply, again according to the FED is only
$9586 BILLION. " A far, far cry from any resembling $11 or $12 Trillion.

$2123 Bln.($2.123 Tillion) + $9586 Bln($9.586 Trillion) = $11.709 Trillion(M1 + M2, your number) or between $11 and $12 Trillion. The math still looks correct to me?

by ClermontThinker Wed Oct 19, 2011 9:42 pm

Wow... DTConcerned... I really just want to pass some information on. There is no reason for this to be a back and forth between you and I. Research is the responsibility that we all have.

Still... Your math is flawed!!

First of all, you will need to understand what M1 and M2 really is.

M1 is the total amount of USD in the following categories;
Checkable Deposits
Traveler's Checks
Demand Checks
All other Checkable Deposits

M2 is the total of M1 and the following;
Small Time Savings
Retail MMMFs
CHECK THIS LINK OUT: http://www.federalreserve.gov/releases/h6/hist/h6hist1.txt

You see, you do not add them. They are relative to each other.

Contrary to your hemp and Ford example petroleum in NOT a renewable resource. I will agree that there are many theories available with a simple Google search. But, the theory has yet to be proven, thus, it is merely a theory. There is no doubt that some standard of oil can be developed by some sort of artificial process. However, as we all know, that is not a practical alternative at the present. And, more importantly in regards to this conversation, it would not be correctly identified as renewable.

More likely your reference of the 1970 estimations of the volume of oil in the ME were just incorrect. I would think that it would be more reasonable to assume that the estimates were off before I would embrace the ill devised conclusion that the petroleum levels are regenerating.

But... I am NOT a geologist.

Keep the faith...

Go RV !!!

by DTConcerned Thu Oct 20, 2011 12:00 pm

My intent was not to debate. This has gotten side tracked from the intent of the quoted portion of the post, I wll grant that some of the foundational data in the explanation may have fault, that was not my research, but the point is still valid; Iraq is not going to have to cash in all the IQD when the RV happens and while the numbers may not be precise, everyone stands to gain from the RV, Iraq is not goint to lose money and each step along the chain only stands to gain. The IQD is a good solid investment, with no more risk then any potentially great investment.

You can argue the validity of the documented renewability of oil reserves, you can argue they don't have to RV at a Rate that will accommodate their budget, you can argue what Shabibi meant by IQD becoming the stongest currency in the ME, or what true value means, or what other members of the GOI meant when they spoke of the strength of the IQD, you can argue that a reasonable source claims to know the value it will RV at.

Logic would not say just because we are using crude oil the earth has stopped making it.
Logic is not perfect when there are unpredictable variables and trusting CBI or GOI statements of value post RV may be the only source of information we have and they could be wrong or just putting out propoganda.

They will not RV at a rate that will deliberately hurt their own country and nobody that would share it knows the final rate until it happens.

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