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 LOP....

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andy1979uk
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PostSubject: LOP....   Fri Aug 09, 2013 3:59 am


Here s another interpretation of what has already been posted on the forum elsewhere....
 
Economic Committee Member call on CBI to start currency structure project
 
 

 
Thursday, 08 August, 2013
Baghdad: Iraq news network called the Parliamentary Commission on the economy and investment the Central Bank of Iraq, the need to delete the zeros of the Iraqi currency after the land was available and exit Iraq from Chapter VII, and the economy is expected advantages and the results summary of Security Council-imposed penalty.
 
 
 
The words of the Rapporteur of the Committee, MP Khalil mehma, in the presence of members of the Committee on the economy and investment, the Central Bank should start a currency structure as a purely economic issue.
 
The Attorney said that the Iraqi Constitution between the need to change and delete the currency required by the economic situation of the country, and the public good, for Parliament and the Government to support the country’s economic identity, expecting to witness the coming budgets increase and prosperity after the investment companies to Iraq, noting that Iraq is not the only country to delete zeros from its currency, the preceding example States Turkey and Lebanon have succeeded bestWhen the economic situation resolution deleted zeros from their currency.
 
the MP Khalil project delete zeros and the objections of the Central Bank and the Government of Iraq requested that wait till an appropriate time and after coming out of Chapter VII all justifications and arguments ended this project. in turn, the alaktasadet Committee member criticized Attorney Abdul Hussein abtan said project delays and the survival of the zeros in the Iraqi currency and forIs it reasonable that the Iraqi Central Bank reserves of 76 billion dollars and now dealing in thousands.
 
The CBI had said in August that it planned to delete the zeros of the Iraqi dinar to facilitate financial transactions made through cash. among the difficulties faced by Iraq if it wanted to delete the zeros of the dinar is pulling about 30 trillion dinars circulating in the Iraqi market is then discarded and replaced with a new currency.
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Fri Aug 09, 2013 4:02 am

replaced with a new currency....




And incase were wondering about the translation of what delete the zeros means....
deleted zeros from their currency
LOP!
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Fri Aug 09, 2013 3:55 pm

One option or idea about what may happen is this......If a coke was 1 USD or 1166 IQD (or 86 cents)…. The CBI removes the 3 zeros making 1166 IQD = 1.166QD (1166 X 0.001=1.16)…. 1 USD or 1.166QD (or 86 cents) for a coke… then they said before they are going to increase the value of the dinar approximately 15%… 15% of 86 cents is 13 cents (86X.15=13)…. 86 cents plus 13 cents is 99 cents (rounded is 1 USD)…. The CBI says that 1 IQD will be par (equal) with 1 USD…. So they did what they said, removed the 3 zeros and raised the value of the dinar...not what we had hoped for...easy transition, easy transactions would not rock their economy all at once...keep the smugglers in check as well. ....
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Fri Aug 09, 2013 4:00 pm

 About time you showed up !!!!  Nice to see you Lopster !!!

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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Fri Aug 09, 2013 5:19 pm

been here and there but thank you....no RV yet so i'll post from time to time to tick some people off or show another view point perhaps...LOL......guru's are constantly at it...bit by bit...tearing into people's emotions if they let them...
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Fri Aug 09, 2013 5:22 pm

You are in good company here Lopster... we have gained a few more LOP members since you were last here.  I think they have been  wanting someone else to chat with. Glad you have stopped in.  I always enjoy your presence.



Actually andy is looking for someone to kick around this article with him.....  

http://www.dinardaily.net/t26461-old-news-but-this-how-every-country-has-managed-a-lop#180368

He is a self proclaimed Lopster also...

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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Fri Aug 09, 2013 5:32 pm

So if it does LOP...does that mean we  get nothing for our dinar we have, or does it mean 1 to 1????  Just trying to understand and help others understand???Rolling Eyes 

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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Fri Aug 09, 2013 5:39 pm

 Horizon,  I think there are different scenarios of the LOP which would create different answers to that.  Some just told me the other day it would mean the 1 to 1 that you just mentioned.  ANd for me, that is fine. I came in expecting 10 cents.

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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Fri Aug 09, 2013 5:44 pm

I would hope you get 1 to 1 however it may be at least 'more' difficult to exchange what would then be the 'older' currency...




That's assuming for example a 25000 note became the equivalent to a new 25 note at what ever exchange they decide... With 2 currencies running at once... The same way every other country in the world ( and their is plenty of them) has managed their redenomination program.. However I just hold some 'in case'
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Fri Aug 09, 2013 5:51 pm

Ponee, I came in the same way thinking low.  One to one is fine with me!  I have a little dong also, that will just be a little extra play money! 
Just come on, do something, and let us cash this stuff in!!!!


 

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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Fri Aug 09, 2013 6:04 pm

Print
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Iraqi dinars are stacked at a teller's window in a Najaf bank.





TEXT SIZE
February 06, 2010

BAGHDAD -- The Iraqi Central Bank is planning to redenominate the national currency in an effort to ease transactions and allow people to carry less paper money, RFE/RL's Radio Free Iraq (RFI) reports.

Mudhhir Muhammad Salih, a member of a Central Bank advisory panel, told RFI that a plan has been made to remove three zeros from the currency and phase out the current banknotes late this year.

Salih said by the end of 2010 the new banknotes will be fully introduced while the old banknotes will be gradually removed from circulation. He did not specify when the new notes would be issued.

Both will be legal tender in Iraq until the old notes are completely withdrawn.

Iraqi officials have had a long-running plan to redenominate the Iraqi dinar. In 2006, the Finance Ministry recommended to the Central Bank that it carry out such a plan.

Salih pointed out that banks are having a hard time accepting cash savings and deposits, but by dropping the zeros it will make it easier for both the banks to deal with their customers and for the general public to carry money. He said some 80 percent of Iraq's money supply is cash in circulation.

Salih added that in 1990 the value of banknotes in circulation was about 25 billion Iraqi dinars but is currently some 25 trillion dinars.

Economic analyst Hilal al-Tahhan told RFI that the bank's move is overdue. He said he expects the currency change to go smoothly because of the decision to allow both the old and new banknotes to coexist, leading to less turbulence in the economy.

The current exchange rate is 1,167 Iraqi dinars to the U.S. dollar.
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Fri Aug 09, 2013 6:05 pm

In black and white... Take it or leave it...
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Fri Aug 09, 2013 8:51 pm

I see a lot of articles posted but rarely see anyone's name associated with who authored it.  As with the guru's, I'm not sure how much stock I put in what the "experts" writing this stuff have to say.  As a broadcast journalism major I know a harmless quote can be manipulated into whatever point of view the writer wants to advance.  I suppose if it's on the net with Baghdad used as the point of origin it must be true!  

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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Fri Aug 09, 2013 10:11 pm

@andy1979uk wrote:
In black and white... Take it or leave it...
Does not actually say anything new. The $100 question is what exactly do they mean by delete the zeros. It COULD mean a lop, but it could ALSO refer to a real change in value. Time will tell.

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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Fri Aug 09, 2013 10:18 pm

If they LOP we would have all waited this stupid thing out for nothing, we won't even get our initial investment back, argh typical!!

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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Sat Aug 10, 2013 5:53 am

If turki came out tomorrow and said... " we are going to lop the currency" us dinarians would be looking for any excuse and any translation to make it sound like it isn't going to lop.... We just don't want to believe it...




“the process of deletion of zeros does not cause a change in the fields or monetary obligations, nor a change in the origin of wealth or income





Turkey and Lebanon have succeeded bestWhen the economic situation resolution deleted zeros from their currency.... In black and white... But we ll come up with a million excuses as to why not... Translational faults... Who said it...
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Sat Aug 10, 2013 8:02 am

Turkey and Lebanon were also very different situations. They were embroiled in hyperinflation and trying to pull out .. that is not the case in Iraq. Here we are looking at a currency that has been set and held artificially low ... that does not reflect the inherent value it should have. Even at 1-1 it would not truly reflect that. Will it go that high? I don't know, it might, even in a worse case scenario, i.e. a LOP, we will still see a pretty good return over time. However because of the rules of the game, I do not see that happening ...

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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Sat Aug 10, 2013 8:07 am

If it does LOP - which I'm not convinced it will in the classic way Andy describes - I guess the only alternative is to hold on to it until it reaches a high point then cash in.
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Sat Aug 10, 2013 8:15 am

 Waco, I am with you. I believe that it is more like Tlar is describing.

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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Sun Aug 11, 2013 8:13 am

Good posting Andy. Hate to say that but it's looks to be true. Co-exiting currency for a period of time. Or at least I see it heading this was. with too much in circulation.
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Sun Aug 11, 2013 3:07 pm

I think they will lop it,the value will fluctuate accordingly,and hopefully I will be able to sell the bit I have when it's on a higher note....

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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Sun Aug 11, 2013 4:13 pm

The only way I see it not lopping is if this is a smoke screen...



I also keep asking if people know they bought 10 printing presses from de la rue?
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Fri Aug 16, 2013 10:28 pm

Interested to hear your thoughts jack?
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Wed Sep 11, 2013 4:21 pm

Forgive me I do know this is slightly off topic but did anyone else see that Columbia is talking about a LOP as well.. if so what are your thoughts on how they would do it compared to Iraq?
I have seen this LOP played out in many different ways, some make sense and some i end up drooling and staring at the computer screen scratching my head.
And forgive me again I may show my "NEWBI" status but why would they want to go a different way about it then other countries in the past if they were successful in their LOP? I know that our situation is slightly different as Kevind56 has stated above, but I guess i still do not understand why they would stray from what they know works.

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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Wed Sep 11, 2013 4:51 pm

Here is the actual article ... it does not look like anything is set in stone but they are seriously contemplating it.
LONDON, June 10 | Mon Jun 10, 2013 2:41pm EDT

(Reuters) - Colombia hopes to lop three zeros off the country's peso currency, a step that might be implemented as soon as mid-2014 when the current presidential term ends, finance minister Mauricio Cardenas said on Monday.

The peso currently trades around 1900 per dollar, making it the smallest-value unit in Latin America after Paraguay's guarani. But President Juan Manuel Santos mooted redenominating it when he took office in 2010.

"It's a very important item on the agenda of President Santos and we are figuring out which is the right time for presenting that deal to Congress," Cardenas told Reuters editors in an interview.

"I can tell you I have ready on my desk a draft bill of what we will present to Congress to get rid of three digits, three zeros...that's something we would do when we consider what is the appropriate time."

Foreign investors in Colombia often struggle with amounts that stretch to 12 zeros and are often confused about whether values are in billions or trillions.

Cardenas declined to give a concrete time frame for the step, but indicated it could happen during the current presidential term which ends in 2014. Once the measure goes to parliament, it should be approved quickly, he said.

"It's something we will do, we've been working on it. It will just make life easier for everyone," he added.

Developing countries that have slashed zeros off their currencies in the past include Mexico in 1993, Russia in 1998, Turkey in 2005 and Ghana in 2007. In the developed world, France redenominated the franc in 1960.

Cardenas said there was support for redenomination but some critics were worried about the cost of printing new banknotes. Others feared losing out because of the rounding up of prices in the newly-denominated currency. (Reporting by Sujata Rao and Carolyn Cohn; editing by Ron Askew)

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/06/10/colombia-peso-idUSL5N0EM31R20130610

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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Wed Sep 11, 2013 5:26 pm

It's a bit of an apples/oranges situation. Columbia is recovering from decades of inflation as high as 40% and unemployment as high as 20% as a result of drug cartels, terrorism, revolution and basic weaknesses in their economy. Iraq is recovering from artificially induced loss of value of their currency. They never had underlying weaknesses causing inflation. They had a currency with an artificially low value imposed upon them after the war.

Their currency was in the $3.20 range before the war, and realistically, looking at their resources today that is where it belongs today. If you look at comparable countries in the area, Kuwait is the closest match and their dinar is valued at about $3.50. I expect, especially given plans for shared facilities that the IQD will also RV to something close. The underlying factors suport such a value, and reality supports it as well.

Is a LOP possible? Yes, absolutely. It could just LOP, it could lop and then RV, it could RV at par and float, it could move directly to the $3.50 range. I hope for an RV, but realize that any number of scenarios are possible. Time will tell.

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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Thu Sep 12, 2013 8:55 am

Thank You for the response. I am aware of the 3.20 and the artificial devalue of their currency, I guess what I can not wrap my head around is how they would LOP it off, which i guess is at the place most people are... Guessing which way makes more sense. However, If you do not mind could you list out the possible Ways they may LOP and what they could or could not cause for us??? And this question goes out to everyone lol

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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Thu Sep 12, 2013 9:11 am

WHERE IS LOPSTER WHEN YOU NEED HIM!!!??? Dang it, seems like he is always taking a leave of absence when we need him!!!

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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Thu Sep 12, 2013 9:33 am

A LOP is pretty straight forward. In round term, a 10,000 note that you paid $10 dolars for, would now be replaced with a 10 note (10,xxx) You would be given a specified time frame in which to exchange the old note for new notes or convert it back to USD at that rate. No loss No gain (technically)

This assumes that the off setting rate is now 1 IQD = 1 USD
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Thu Sep 12, 2013 9:50 am

you rang?

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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Thu Sep 12, 2013 10:10 am

@DinarPhoenix wrote:
A LOP is pretty straight forward. In round term, a 10,000 note that you paid $10 dolars for, would now be replaced with a 10 note (10,xxx) You would be given a specified time frame in which to exchange the old note for new notes or convert it back to USD at that rate. No loss No gain (technically)

This assumes that the off setting rate is now 1 IQD = 1 USD
OK so if this is true and it is a giant = sign... then how would this benefit us and why do people believe it will benefit us? I think that is what i'm having a hard time understanding.. lots of positive tlk out there about the LOP, but I honestly do not see a positive side.
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Thu Sep 12, 2013 10:11 am

nice wpsmit, my son is so cute...but DinarPhoenix is right....a lop is a no loss no gain situation. It will help to lessen the amount of currency as well. Like Kevin says, just be aware that it "could" happen..we can not close the door on the idea...we hold inflationary notes...over 60% when it was over 3 dollars and now inflation is under control which is a whole different situation now...i would think they would want a slow easy transition as they make a move towards changing their currency.


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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Thu Sep 12, 2013 10:14 am

no positive side about a lop...revenue neutral move....
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Thu Sep 12, 2013 10:17 am

we all got into this just for iraq to do a straight RV with the currency we have now...but for the last few years the flood of the zero articles only make me nervous...they "could" easily just start over with new currency...i would think it would also weed out the smugglers and counterfeiter peeps.
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Thu Sep 12, 2013 10:23 am

 Thanks for stopping in Lopster - I hear you  are quite busy today at work so I appreciat the visit.  Maybe when you have a little more time,  Daox13 can pick your brain.

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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Thu Sep 12, 2013 10:31 am

Well that does make more sense because that's the way i have always viewed it. I have always though that if the LOP to a 1=1 then we go neutral... But It confused me that not everyone thought of it that way... So I thought maybe I was missing something when it came to the LOP. Thanx for the info.. i look forward to hearing more Smile

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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Thu Sep 12, 2013 10:32 am

Thanks Ponee....and yes Daox13, we really don't want a lop at all Smile....take care guys
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Thu Sep 12, 2013 11:18 am

I think, worse case, we see a lop and a float. In that case we will still see a profit, just much smaller, for argument's sake let's stick to the eventual $3.50 range, so we would see a 3.5% return, not too shabby in the real world. Again, only time will tell.

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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Thu Sep 12, 2013 11:36 am

there have been many remors that the real reason for the stalling is in the very near future the new money will come out totaly different and guess what . our money will have the same value as now nothing. we hold useless money and thats it and will not be recognized as the new money will have value and we are holding the bag. wait and see. if this was a world wide event it would have been done along time ago and if iraq really wanted it it would have been done .this is why they use a 2 currency system they do not need value to the dinar we do .not iraq. one last thing thru the centuries they were very cunning merchants and they might pull off the biggest scam of mankind on us hope i am wrong but?


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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Thu Sep 12, 2013 5:52 pm

In the words of Paul Harvey "And now, the rest of the story" Short of a civil war, a straight up LOP would be the worst case scenario. Some would say that Iraq does not need an RV, but to be internationally recognized they do. Furthermore, if having their own currency was never the objective WHY print new money at all, just declare the dollar the offical currency and be done with it. Why go through the hassel and expnese of setting up a Central Banking System. Its clear that for many reasons, including pride, Iraq does want their own currency and to be recognized internationally.

To some the "project to delete the zeros" is not a LOP, but a project designed to reel in the large notes when the lower denoms are printed and the currency is revalued. In this case, everyone who holds Dinar becomes wealthy. Do foreign countries own dinar with the promise of an RV ? Have contractors been paid in Dinar with the promise of an RV ? If these questions are true then a LOP is absolutely out of the qustion. A LOP does nothing for us, but it also does nothing for the country of Iraq. It is in their intrest to re-instate the value of their currency back to where it was prior to the invasion. The GOI would have all the money it needs to rebuild the infastructure and become the fastest growing economy in the world. In a matter of 20 years they would look like Dubai and Kuwait. They do this for themselves not us. We are just a by product of executive order 13303

This is the hope we hold on to.
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Thu Sep 12, 2013 6:26 pm

I agree that a LOP is a worse case scenario, still it is a possible scenario, and thus we need to consider it. Many have said that for it to go international the dinar has to have some value. Well it has some value now, in fact, it has more value than some internationally traded currencies. I would disagree that a LOP does nothing for Iraq, it makes accounting much easier, and reduces the sheer volume of currency needed for any given transaction. Folks would be able to carry their cash in their pocket instead of a suitcase, so yea, there would be a benefit.

I personally believe that an RV in the $3.50 range is the most likely scenario, however we need to consider the possibilities of a RV at par, a float, or a LOP, most likely followed by a float or RV. Any way it happens, it will IMO be a win for us.

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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Thu Sep 12, 2013 6:40 pm

OMG!!!!! DELETE THE ZEROS MEANS REMOVE THE LARGE DENOMS FROM CIRCULATION.....yes... they will have a new currency in the form of smaller notes (any thing else is BS in my opinion) which are already printed.. these banknotes are in 1,5,10,20 last i heard up to 1000 dollar note and eventually these banknotes will have the Kurdish language printed on it possibly another new banknote..they will not print another new currency...period..
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Thu Sep 12, 2013 7:59 pm

just hope it does something that is more then now
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Fri Sep 13, 2013 3:39 am

@Kevind53 wrote:
I think, worse case, we see a lop and a float. In that case we will still see a profit, just much smaller, for argument's sake let's stick to the eventual $3.50 range, so we would see a 3.5% return, not too shabby in the real world. Again, only time will tell.
I don't know about that Kevin.  A 3.5% return on a high risk investment for only a year would be a really crappy return IMO.  An a 3.5% return on a high risk invest in 8 years is.... well, you know.
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Fri Sep 13, 2013 8:00 am

It would be more like 350% if my math is right ... you're more than tripling your investment. 3.5% would be three and a half cents on the dollar.

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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Fri Sep 13, 2013 11:47 am

@DinarPhoenix wrote:
In the words of Paul Harvey "And now, the rest of the story" Short of a civil war, a straight up LOP would be the worst case scenario. Some would say that Iraq does not need an RV, but to be internationally recognized they do. Furthermore, if having their own currency was never the objective WHY print new money at all, just declare the dollar the offical currency and be done with it. Why go through the hassel and expnese of setting up a Central Banking System. Its clear that for many reasons, including pride, Iraq does want their own currency and to be recognized internationally.

To some the "project to delete the zeros" is not a LOP, but a project designed to reel in the large notes when the lower denoms are printed and the currency is revalued. In this case, everyone who holds Dinar becomes wealthy. Do foreign countries own dinar with the promise of an RV ? Have contractors been paid in Dinar with the promise of an RV ? If these questions are true then a LOP is absolutely out of the qustion. A LOP does nothing for us, but it also does nothing for the country of Iraq. It is in their intrest to re-instate the value of their currency back to where it was prior to the invasion. The GOI would have all the money it needs to rebuild the infastructure and become the fastest growing economy in the world. In a matter of 20 years they would look like Dubai and Kuwait. They do this for themselves not us. We are just a by product of executive order 13303

This is the hope we hold on to.

This is True. Why else would India begin trading their currency for a currency that would be worthless in the coming months...
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Sun Sep 22, 2013 3:28 pm

Well, I used to pull your pigtails
And pinch your turned-up nose
But you been a growin
And baby, it's been showin
From your head down to your toes

Little sister, don't you
Little sister, don't you
Little sister, don't you kiss me once or twice
Then say it's very nice
And then you run

Little sister, don't you
Do what your big sister done

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EVEN CRAZIES LOVE INDEPENDENCE DAY
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Sun Sep 22, 2013 4:33 pm

@DinarPhoenix wrote:
 We are just a by product of executive order 13303

This is the hope we hold on to.
Can you show me where in EO 13303 it says what everyone implies it says?  It is only one page and I seem to keep missing the part that allegedly allows us regular people to buy dinar.  Thanks
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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Sun Sep 22, 2013 5:08 pm

Daox13, first of all it s not a worthless currency. It has a definite value, $1166/USD. Maybe small, but it IS a value. Since they are buying huge quantities of oil from Iraq, it is to their advantage to try and get some of their Rupees back. Simple economics really.

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PostSubject: Re: LOP....   Sun Sep 22, 2013 5:16 pm

It's implied perhaps. As best as I can understand it it allows us to "trade" with the GOI and thus buy and sell their currency. You have to try and put it together from the content of the other EOs referenced and by reading between the lines.

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